North Summit Co

[20-20 vision man]

I was involved in auto accidnet. I have a CCW but was not carrying. Ran into cop many days later. He confronted me and verbally repremanded me for not telling him I have a CCW permit. He went further to say he would have handled the investigation of the accident different had he known I had a CCW permit. I ask his mayor and police chief how he would have treated me different. Two months + has lapsed and no response. Macadonia is a good place to stay out of if you have a CCW permit and wanted to be treated like a god fearing american. Hitler would be proud of the actions of some of this police department.

20-20 vision man

[rhwiley]

I was involved in auto accident. I have a CCW but was not carrying. Ran into cop many days later. He confronted me and verbally repremanded me for not telling him I have a CCW permit. He went further to say he would have handled the investigation of the accident different had he known I had a CCW permit.

I don't like to be too confrontational and IANAL, but I do tend to like making a point (when I know I'm correct) - just for the sake of the people this guy might meet in the future.

This is just a thought about your situation, but I think I would've tried to remain as calm as possible and asked him to show me in the ORC (Ohio Revised Code) where it says I must notify him during times when I'm not carrying. Tell him that maybe the copy of the code you read was outdated, and you'd like to see where his information comes from.

If he can (and I doubt very much that he can), offer a sincere apology and call it a day.

I think I would avoid asking him how it would have affected how he manages a simple traffic incident (assuming they are exclusive), only because anything further could embarrass him further.

My main reason to avoid further embarrassment, is sometimes it's a good idea to educate the uninformed and cut your losses. Leave him with a slightly red face but with hopefully a thought in his mind that says, "that guy was really concerned that he might be wrong - what a professional attitude". Positive impressions can be lasting ones - if you can manage to replace the pre-existing evil attitudes. Look at it this way, this guy might have simply been reading too much of OCAGV's propaganda.

[Harlie]

Assuming you were driving your vehicle, why didn't he (LEO) know that you had a license to carry. your tag should have been a clue. If you precieved that to be an attempt to intimidate, notice should be given. LEO may have failed in correctly handling the accident, as well.

[Henry Bowman]

Assuming you were driving your vehicle, why didn't he (LEO) know that you had a license to carry. your tag should have been a clue.

The vehicle I usually drive is registered in my wife's name only. The vehicle that she usually drives is in my name only. She does not have a CHL.

Maybe he meant that he would have treated you better or have not cited you if he had know that you were one of the "good guys."

[ballistic]

I was involved in auto accidnet. I have a CCW but was not carrying. Ran into cop many days later. He confronted me and verbally repremanded me for not telling him I have a CCW permit.

I presume this was the same cop that was at the scene of your accident. How you happened to run into the same cop days later is unfortunate. He sounds like he was just looking for an argument. I would've informed him as tactfully as I could that the ORC doesn't require you to notify if you're not carrying. If you haven't done so already, perhaps it's not too late to write to the chief about this particular issue.

[ballistic]

Macadonia is a good place to stay out of if you have a CCW permit and wanted to be treated like a god fearing american.

Thanks for the advisement. Now that you've waved the red flag in front of me I'll be sure to drive through Macedonia at my earliest convenience.

[Aaron]

I am in Macedonia all the time(atleast 3 times a week, Ive even open carried inside the Walmart in the Commons.

Got pulled over for going a little fast in the parking lot once, I informed him that I was a CHL holder and was indeed carrying. Like the one in Independence on Rockside rd, he did Not ask to see my License. He did however check to see if it was unconcealed, so by doing that I have to assume most officers in Macedonia know the carry laws. Gave me a warning and told me to have a good day.

Whether they frown upon it or not as a whole I have no idea. Ive open carried in the Home depot, Lowes, Best Buy and Giant Eagle out there too. That was one of the 2 times I got brave. I havent done it since though

On both occassions, the Officers respected my telling them as they approached that I had a CHL.

It takes 1.5 seconds to do so people, whether youre carrying or not. So why not do it?

[TunnelRat]

It takes 1.5 seconds to do so people, whether youre carrying or not. So why not do it?

Because that is not the law!

Regular, consistent, inconsequential chipping away at our rights under the law will erode our liberties and eventually lead us into a police state. It is the principle of government always to increase its authority at the cost of its citizens' rights. Under our constitutional republican system we cede certain limited authority to the government, but it will always seek to take more.

As an example, consider the recent Ohio Supreme Court decision in Klein v. Leis. The Ohio Supremes claimed that Ohio has been an Open Carry state for the past 200 years. Well, you coulda fooled me. Because we as citizens have failed to assert our right to open carry, we have pretty much lost it.

It is one thing to volunteer our CHL status to LEOs when we are not carrying, as a courtesy to them -- they've got a hard enough job. It is altogether another thing when our courteously volunteering such information becomes expected, then the standard, and eventually the requirement.

[NavyChief]

OK, help me out here.
When your tag is run, DMV ties your CHL to your car and/or DL? (What is up with that?)
Then why the necessity to tell LE? Am I missing something?

[Willy P]

The inform clause is a "warm fuzzy" so the officers have to be informed if you are on foot or in someone else's car. If I'm a passenger with a buddy with no CHL even though I was not speeding and he is pulled over while I'm in the car I am under duty to inform. I think that is what you were looking for Cheif?

[Aaron]

It takes 1.5 seconds to do so people, whether youre carrying or not. So why not do it?

Because that is not the law!

Regular, consistent, inconsequential chipping away at our rights under the law will erode our liberties and eventually lead us into a police state. It is the principle of government always to increase its authority at the cost of its citizens' rights. Under our constitutional republican system we cede certain limited authority to the government, but it will always seek to take more.

As an example, consider the recent Ohio Supreme Court decision in Klein v. Leis. The Ohio Supremes claimed that Ohio has been an Open Carry state for the past 200 years. Well, you coulda fooled me. Because we as citizens have failed to assert our right to open carry, we have pretty much lost it.

It is one thing to volunteer our CHL status to LEOs when we are not carrying, as a courtesy to them -- they've got a hard enough job. It is altogether another thing when our courteously volunteering such information becomes expected, then the standard, and eventuall
y the requirement.

well then people better not {inappropriate language} when they dont inform(because its not the law) and something happens to ruin your day, which otherwise would have been a 20 second "hello, inform and be on your way" kind of day.

It wont kill you to be a little extra curteous, whether its the law or not.

The thread starters incident is a perfect example. And because of that, he thinks Macedonia is a nasty place to carry, when in reality, it could be the very opposite. Not much more to say really.

I was carrying in both incidents, but I can guarantee that if something happens and Im NOT carrying..I'll inform the officer.

It might go something like this....

"I know it's not required that I inform you when not carrying, but I am a CHL holder"

[20-20 vision man]

The computer was down when my license was run. That is why cop did not know if I had a CCW.

The whole thing boils down to this. This man made up his own laws. He is not a law maker or did his law go through the state government. The important part is he stated he would have treated me different. I ask how different? The whole police department from LT to chief refused to answer. Would he of taken me to McDonalds had I told him I had this card? I think not. I look in the news papers in Portage County and see how men are put on the ground and handcuffed then ask if they have a CCW permit. When they answer yes they are let go. I didnt know you had to lay on ground with guns pointed at you handcuffed to answer questions about CCW permits. This is something we all have to deal with.

20-20 vision man......

[TunnelRat]

I look in the news papers in Portage County and see how men are put on the ground and handcuffed then ask if they have a CCW permit. When they answer yes they are let go. I didnt know you had to lay on ground with guns pointed at you handcuffed to answer questions about CCW permits. This is something we all have to deal with.

We deal with that sort of thing by hiring a competent trial lawyer. If a police officer points a gun at you, he'd better have a very good reason. Assault is assault, whether committed by a private citizen or by a uniformed officer -- except it is a lot more serious when it is done under color of law.

We all need to respect and abide by the law -- all of them: the ones we like and the ones we don't. The same holds true in spades for the uniformed officer. It is far too serious to let the police power of the government get out of control.

Having said all that -- it has been my experience that most LEOs are friendly and efficient. Their job is hard enough already without me making one more difficulty for them...

[jgarvas]

The computer was down when my license was run. That is why cop did not know if I had a CCW.

The whole thing boils down to this. This man made up his own laws. He is not a law maker or did his law go through the state government. The important part is he stated he would have treated me different. I ask how different? The whole police department from LT to chief refused to answer. Would he of taken me to McDonalds had I told him I had this card? I think not.

I've commented on this stop in other community forums. Maybe he misunderstood the law and the fact that you didn't have to notify, or maybe he assumed you HAD a firearm, until you told him later you didn't.

I think what the officer meant was, had he known 20-20 was licensed, he may not have cited him for the traffic accident and let the courts figure it out. No citation means a lot less headaches in the court, as opposed to "fault" being determined by the office on scene.

If that is what he meant, he can't ever admit to it. The fact is there are cops out there that will give you a break if you're a license holder, and I believe that is what this officer meant.

If a cop intends to treat CHL holders "worse" as 20-20 is implying, how would it be in their best interests to tell you that to your face? The fact that this officer did makes me think my theory is even more likely. The fact that nobody else in the department will even talk about it is par for the course. You never admit to giving away perks, and you never admit that there is such a thing as a ticket quota.

I look in the news papers in Portage County and see how men are put on the ground and handcuffed then ask if they have a CCW permit. When they answer yes they are let go. I didnt know you had to lay on ground with guns pointed at you handcuffed to answer questions about CCW permits. This is something we all have to deal with.

The Portage County stop was a "man with a gun" call. In today's society the sad fact is "man with a gun" calls will result in a full felony take down stop of this style. If the license plates came back "CHL" I'd consider this a little bit extreme, but what if the computer was down? The cops had to react quickly and with their safety in mind. If it did come back "CHL" some cops would only consider that confirmation that a gun probably was seen, and react as their training taught them.

Is it fair? No. Are we ever going to be able to change something like that?

Maybe when bad guys stop doing bad things with guns, but until then the officers are acting in manner that gives them the tactical advantage, safest and fastest approach to determining your threat level to them.

If you were a "bad guy" and you had a gun, its harder to shoot at the cops with your hands behind your back, your face in the pavement, and your ankles crossed.

[Aaron]

Thats the "Post of the day" for sure

Telling the officer can never hurt.

A few spoken words go a long way.