Shooting death and injury on Alec Baldwin movie set.

[Bruenor]

This article mentions the firearms prop master is 24 and this is only the second movie she has worked as the head firearms individual. On my phone dunno how you people copy and paste from these things easily. Here’s the link


https://www.latimes.com/entertainment-a ... ed-off-set" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[EricTheBald]

Immediately after the shooting, Baldwin began blaming someone else and it looks like the media is going along with that.

I don't care if Jesus himself descends from heaven and hands you what he claims is a "Cold Gun".

Until YOU check the gun YOURSELF, it's real and it's loaded. Period. Full Stop.

A drunk, homeless Veteran could have provided better weapons management

[catfish86]

Having reviewed a lot of the reports I believe Alec Baldwin should be charged with manslaughter. If he had spent a little bit of time reading the NRA's gun safety rules instead of attacking them, nobody gets hurt.

1) Always assume the gun is loaded. The unspoken part of this is if you are handed a gun you never trust anything other than your own check that it is clear.

2) NEVER point the gun at anything you aren't willing to destroy. Clear or not this gun should never have been pointed in anyone's direction.

3) Keep your finger off the trigger until you are ready to fire.

What is more, Alec Baldwin is a producer and only hours before a number of the filming crew left after 2 or 3 accidental discharges. This screams negligence resulting in death.

[evan price]

The media (and sheriff's department) keep referring to the firearm used as a "prop gun". By my understanding, a prop gun is just a lookalike, doesn't fire ammunition or blanks.

Any object used in filming is a prop. They may use rubber guns, "non- guns', blank firing guns, real guns modified to not fire, or real guns. It depends on the scene in question and the director.
Since the Hexum and Lee fatalities Hollywood unions demanded and got armored on set and a lot better gun handling practices.
However this movie, the armorer was inexperienced and despite being from a family business of cinema armorers. she said she was uneasy with taking over a movie as the main armorer. And due to prior incidents on this set the union either quit or walked off.

[schmieg]

The media (and sheriff's department) keep referring to the firearm used as a "prop gun". By my understanding, a prop gun is just a lookalike, doesn't fire ammunition or blanks.

Any object used in filming is a prop. They may use rubber guns, "non- guns', blank firing guns, real guns modified to not fire, or real guns. It depends on the scene in question and the director.
Since the Hexum and Lee fatalities Hollywood unions demanded and got armored on set and a lot better gun handling practices.
However this movie, the armorer was inexperienced and despite being from a family business of cinema armorers. she said she was uneasy with taking over a movie as the main armorer. And due to prior incidents on this set the union either quit or walked off.

As I recall, the original Magnificent Seven (far better than the remake) used live ammunition in the scene where Steve McQueen fires the shotgun from the top of the hearse and shoots out the window in the building. The rest of the area around the window was heavily armored and the man at the window was supposed to drop down after sticking a gun out the window. He did, but they decided, even though it was planned, that it was too close and changed policies for the use of live ammo after that.

Here, the only excuse for Baldwin not checking the gun and not pointing and firing it at the camera would be if the scene required someone to toss it to him to turn and fire at the camera for the visual effect. But, even then, there are usually enough cuts and splices to allow a live round to be discovered. I see the strong likelihood of criminal negligence here, but I imagine the armorer will take the fall and Baldwin will be whitewashed. Civil liability is another matter though.

[Brian D.]

Since the Hexum and Lee fatalities Hollywood unions demanded and got armored on set and a lot better gun handling practices.
However this movie, the armorer was inexperienced and despite being from a family business of cinema armorers. she said she was uneasy with taking over a movie as the main armorer. And due to prior incidents on this set the union either quit or walked off.

That seems to be the current spin. I'm not ready to buy it as the truth just yet though. Sure I'm biased against Baldwin, but I truly believe he'd throw anyone and everyone under the proverbial bus to escape taking blame here. On Friday there were reports from crew that the gun in question belonged to Baldwin and he'd been target shooting with it earlier.

[evan price]

That seems to be the current spin. I'm not ready to buy it as the truth just yet though. Sure I'm biased against Baldwin, but I truly believe he'd throw anyone and everyone under the proverbial bus to escape taking blame here. On Friday there were reports from crew that the gun in question belonged to Baldwin and he'd been target shooting with it earlier.

I'd heard and repeated that myself.
Ultimately it's the responsibility of whomever pulls the trigger what happens with any gun.
As always whenever something goes wrong it's often not just one error but a chain of circumstances leading up to the disaster.

[catfish86]

That seems to be the current spin. I'm not ready to buy it as the truth just yet though. Sure I'm biased against Baldwin, but I truly believe he'd throw anyone and everyone under the proverbial bus to escape taking blame here. On Friday there were reports from crew that the gun in question belonged to Baldwin and he'd been target shooting with it earlier.

I'd heard and repeated that myself.
Ultimately it's the responsibility of whomever pulls the trigger what happens with any gun.
As always whenever something goes wrong it's often not just one error but a chain of circumstances leading up to the disaster.

One hundred percent true. Alec Baldwin, even if the current spin that Asst Director David Hall handed the gun to Baldwin and declared it clear, is responsible. If I am at a gun shop and the clerk clears the gun and hands it to me, I clear it myself even though I just watched him do it. I would hope I NEVER do what Baldwin did. Even cases where the scene calls for a gun firing into the camera it is done with an unmanned camera. That being said, Alec Baldwin will never be held accountable. As a matter of fact now there are petitions to ban guns on movie sets. Rather than taking a class of firearms safety and accepting responsibility, they again attack the tool.

[TSiWRX]

I'll preface this by confessing that I've never even been close to a movie set, let alone been in a movie, much less starred in one.

Is anyone here actually in the industry? or have experience being a set armorer?

The reason why I am asking is because I find it rather incredulous that the actor himself would be responsible for knowing the status of "the weapon" - and I'm putting that in quotes as, truly, it's not a "weapon" when on-set, right'? it's a prop, just like any other prop that the actor/actress would have interactions with, no?

Let's look at a film like John Wick or The Matrix. Are Reeves - since we're all speaking so highly of him, here - or his co-stars supposed to check every single blank and dummy cartridge used? Scene after scene, take after take? https://melmagazine.com/en-us/story/the ... were-fired" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;. Remember it's not about just the gunshots we see on-screen, but also every shot that was taken in order to get to what we do see - and also in all the footage we don't see, too.

Maybe that *_is_* the case, and hence it's why I'm asking. But in my mind, I don't see them preparing for stepping out onto the set like what any one of us would do in our preparations for a range day, training class, competition - or for that matter "gassing up" and preparing to step foot out of our door every morning.

[docachna]

Some reports now say a bunch of union crew walked out a couple hours before this (film) shooting, and non-union replacements were on site. Doesn't make for happy campers.

It's also being bandied about that the casing for the fired round disappeared before LEO arrived.

We won't know anything until at least after the criminal investigation concludes, and probably damn little then, given the Cali tendency to protect "special people".

Finally, a very interesting interview with John Schneider ("Them Damn Dukes !!!!"), an ardent 2A supporter (which probably explains why you haven't seen him anywhere but Newsmax about this one).

https://fb.watch/8RBsrMAyB-/

He had some very interesting observations about the whole thing, particularly the fact that Baldwin is also a producer on the project, and therefore responsible for staffing, including the armorer and prop people. Also the fact that a true "prop gun" doesn't even have a firing pin, and thus, whatever was used in this debacle, it was NOT a prop gun.

Personally - I wouldn't be surprised if we ended up finding out a local union worker slipped a live round into the pistol, then absconded with the empty casing after the shooting. No evidence to support it at present, but it's a logical explanation, and maybe one of the more likely explanations.

Hopefully we find out one day.

[TSiWRX]

^ I also think that Baldwin being a Producer is what's going to really mess things up for him, legally.

In terms of the words "prop gun," I thought that was way too ambiguous - that in the industry, it carried multiple meanings: everything from a non-functional replica to a true firearm that is loaded with blanks.

[EricTheBald]

Are Reeves... or his co-stars supposed to check every single blank and dummy cartridge used?

Nobody is saying he's supposed to check every cartridge.

What we ARE saying is that every time he is handed a gun he should check it to see if it's real or fake, empty or loaded, and loaded with what.

Wouldn't YOU?

[Bruenor]

Using a prop gun for live ammo target practice around time of filming. The more I hear about this incident the more I believe it comes back to the firearms prop master not having proper controls in place.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... arsal.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The gun that killed the cinematographer on the set of Alec Baldwin's Rust had been used for target practice by crew members, sources linked to the western film's production said.

Multiple sources connected to the set of Rust told TMZ that the same Colt pistol that went off in Alec Baldwin's hands, killing Halyna Hutchins and injuring director Joel Souza, had been used recreationally by crew members.

The sources claim that some crew members would go off for target practice using real bullets, and some believe a live round from those practice sessions found its way onto the set.

Another source told TMZ that live ammo and blanks were being stored in the same area on set, offering another possible explanation as to how a bullet was fired from Baldwin's Colt.

A search warrant released Friday said that Rust armorer Hannah Gutierrez-Reed, 24, had laid out three prop guns on a cart outside the filming location, and first assistant director Dave Halls grabbed the Colt from the cart and brought it inside to Baldwin, unaware that it was loaded with live rounds.

'Cold gun!' shouted Halls before handing the gun to Baldwin, using the phrase to signal to cast and crew that the gun was safe to fire for the scene, the warrant said.

Hollywood professionals say they're baffled by the circumstances and production crews have quickly stepped up safety measures.

Jeffrey Wright, who has worked on projects including the James Bond franchise and the upcoming movie 'The Batman,' was acting with a weapon on the set of 'Westworld' when news broke of the shooting Thursday at a New Mexico ranch. 'We were all pretty shocked. And it informed what we did from that moment on,' he said in an interview Sunday at the Newport Beach Film Festival.

'I don't recall ever being handed a weapon that was not cleared in front of me - meaning chamber open, barrel shown to me, light flashed inside the barrel to make sure that it's cleared,' Wright said. 'Clearly, that was a mismanaged set.'

Actor Ray Liotta agreed with Wright that the checks on firearms are usually extensive.

'They always - that I know of - they check it so you can see,' Liotta said. 'They give it to the person you're pointing the gun at, they do it to the producer, they show whoever is there that it doesn't work.'

[carmen fovozzo]

The gun was fired twice ?

[pirateguy191]

From CNN.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/10/25/entertai ... index.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;