Straw Purchaser/Gun Trafficker/Criminal?

[roughsawn]

I think you made the right decision. However, since you were already at Bass Pro Shop, could you have walked in there with him and your AK and used them to do an FFL transfer?

[Werz]

I think you made the right decision. However, since you were already at Bass Pro Shop, could you have walked in there with him and your AK and used them to do an FFL transfer?

Interesting proposal. That might have been rather funny.

[Glock513]

You did the right thing, and actually, you followed the law specifically as you did NOT personally believe that the guy was clear of having any prohibitions. So not selling to him was the right move.

HOWEVER.

You made a litany of wild, nearly irrational assumptions on a slew of what is quite often (most often?!) completely and entirely LEGAL activity.

For instance, it is not illegal to buy and sell guns "all the time" without an FFL. When it -not- legal is a gray area and his quick words certainly wouldn't define anything. It takes quite a bit more to be even accused by the BATFE of dealing guns without a license than the serious lack of anything tangible you had on this guy.

Next, having a rifle in his truck is not an illegal activity in the State of Ohio, and it doesn't matter if he was coming from work, a gun range, or his church or a city park or Wal-Mart or _________. Again, wild assumptions based on very, very little with almost no "real" information.

Would also submit that if you looked him up on the Clerk of Courts and found THAT kind of rap sheet...
Was it really the best move to show up in HOPES that he'd have a CHL so that you could wipe the sweat from your brow and continue with the sale?!
Would it not have been a better idea to cancel the sale ahead of time and not meet up at all?

Again, the law states that you can't knowingly sell to a prohibited person and you did have reasons personally to believe that he MAY have been prohibited, so -NOT- selling was the right thing to do AND it was the lawful thing to do, so I fully support the action you took.

And while you may be right in all of your assumptions...
You may also be quite wrong.

It's okay to be wrong, but we'll still point it out.

Buying and selling guns all day, every day is illegal unless he's a FFL. Selling a gun from your collection is ok, but if you buying and selling guns all day everyday, like a business conducting transactions daily without a FFL, yes, that is VERY illegal.

On the other stuff, I did make assumptions that might be true or not true. Having a CCW permit would've cleared all of my concerns up. I have a very common name too, there are like 40 people in Cincinnati, OH with my name . I don't regret my decision one bit or the assumptions that I made about him... based on his own words and demeanor. I've dealt with plenty of honest gun owners. I'm pretty sure that he was NOT one of them.

[Glock513]

I think you made the right decision. However, since you were already at Bass Pro Shop, could you have walked in there with him and your AK and used them to do an FFL transfer?

I thought about it, but I'm pretty sure that they wouldn't do it since it's not THEIR transaction. Thought about calling my buddy, who is a FFL dealer, and have him run the dude through NCIS but I came to a conclusion based on his choice words, and him fitting the description of the criminal I looked up on clerk of courts. I TOLD him via email that I would verify his license and CCW permit face to face during the sell, he knew that. He thought that he could waive money in my face and BS me into giving him the gun. NOPE, ain't happening .

[techguy85]

most FFLs will do a transfer no problem. Just a matter of how much they charge for it.

[WestonDon]

It would be interesting what his reaction would be to being asked to go inside for an FFL transfer.

[MrKitty]

I would not have even shown up and cancelled ahead of time. It's been said several times, but you really have to trust your gut feeling.

[wobblygoblin]

As some have said, you trusted your gut because your gut is almost always right. Good job. I don't blame you for showing up even after having looked up the name in the court records. It could have been, as you said, someone else with that name and not him. I think at least showing up and seeing what the deal was was reasonable. After all, it could have been someone like Dick York, squeaky clean, wearing a bow tie and as upstanding as they come. Like you said, the test was the CHL, it was part of the deal he had it and you saw he didn't so good job.

[Glock513]

As some have said, you trusted your gut because your gut is almost always right. Good job. I don't blame you for showing up even after having looked up the name in the court records. It could have been, as you said, someone else with that name and not him. I think at least showing up and seeing what the deal was was reasonable. After all, it could have been someone like Dick York, squeaky clean, wearing a bow tie and as upstanding as they come. Like you said, the test was the CHL, it was part of the deal he had it and you saw he didn't so good job.

Yeah, I really wanted to give him the benefit of a doubt. It's like saying John Smith is a pimp/heroin dealer/dope addict/5-time felon, that's nice but WHICH John Smith, there are like 1,000 John Smiths in Cincinnati, OH alone . There's another John Smith that's a law abiding citizen, a LEO, a respectable OFCC member, etc. I gave him the benefit of a doubt, and he turned out to be a dud. Oh well. Good news though, my gun will be sold within the hour once my auction ends, and this time it's being transferred through a FFL and not a possible convicted felon/gun trafficker/drugdealer

[A_F]

Guess ill weight in too, since im bored.

Yes you were right to deny the sale, no i wouldnt bother calling the police. Only because it would have been your word against his and his buddies, and no office witnesses the attempted purchase. Waste of resources.

[Javelin Man]

Do you know why there are so many John Smith's in the Cincinnati phone book?




They all have phones.

[Metal1]

Not sure what NCIS would do? NCIC maybe? And FFL's can't access it anyway.

[JustaShooter]

Not sure what NCIS would do? NCIC maybe? And FFL's can't access it anyway.

NICS perhaps.

[Cygnus]

You did the right thing, and actually, you followed the law specifically as you did NOT personally believe that the guy was clear of having any prohibitions. So not selling to him was the right move.

HOWEVER.

You made a litany of wild, nearly irrational assumptions on a slew of what is quite often (most often?!) completely and entirely LEGAL activity.

For instance, it is not illegal to buy and sell guns "all the time" without an FFL. When it -not- legal is a gray area and his quick words certainly wouldn't define anything. It takes quite a bit more to be even accused by the BATFE of dealing guns without a license than the serious lack of anything tangible you had on this guy.

Next, having a rifle in his truck is not an illegal activity in the State of Ohio, and it doesn't matter if he was coming from work, a gun range, or his church or a city park or Wal-Mart or _________. Again, wild assumptions based on very, very little with almost no "real" information.

Would also submit that if you looked him up on the Clerk of Courts and found THAT kind of rap sheet...
Was it really the best move to show up in HOPES that he'd have a CHL so that you could wipe the sweat from your brow and continue with the sale?!
Would it not have been a better idea to cancel the sale ahead of time and not meet up at all?

Again, the law states that you can't knowingly sell to a prohibited person and you did have reasons personally to believe that he MAY have been prohibited, so -NOT- selling was the right thing to do AND it was the lawful thing to do, so I fully support the action you took.

And while you may be right in all of your assumptions...
You may also be quite wrong.

It's okay to be wrong, but we'll still point it out.

Couldn't agree more. Get a huge kick out of all these armchair detectives.