College OC!?!

[feltoosj]

A "school" (in terms of "school zone") refers to a high/middle/elementary school.

Colleges/universities are different, and as far as I know it would be legal. The ORC specifically says that CONCEALED carry is illegal on college campuses but really says nothing about OC (well, it does, but as I learned today you have to be well-versed in the ORC to find it).

Even the campus police capt. (a real cop, too) said that they'd arrest someone OCing for inducing a panic (which I still don't think would fly).

[meansartin]

I've also signed a civil agreement to act in accordance with the ORC too. Specifically I can do anything that is not a felony or misdemeanor.

Yeah but I'm not sure how much you can rely on your tacit consent to obey the laws of Ohio in this one.
*EDIT*Not sure if you meant your CHL or not.

Although now I think I might ask my campus PD about this too, just to see how quick they get back to me. If the holster protest didn't ruffle feathers: then this will make them s**t bricks....

[feltoosj]

sean: if they're nice, they'll just cite the exact same things.

Sadly, I was wrong about OCing on campus
Good thing I wrote my state reps yesterday. I should just buy a bunch of stamps and pull an Andy Dufresne till they cave in.

[SeanC]

BIG SHAFE wrote:
Good point, but there is still conflicting statements in the code.

Not really - you can sign away your rights to many things. For example, if you're willing to sign a contract stating that you won't carry in my place of business, I'd have cause to sue you (even if it's not a posted CPZ) if you carried there in spite of our prior agreement.

Not entirely accurate. If I sign a contract with you that I won't exercise my first amendment right to give a lecture on gun policy in front of your store, I still have that right. I agreed to let you sue me if I exercise the right, but I've still got it. There are very, very limited situations in which you actually give up a right. Plea bargains and arbitration agreements (both involving your right to trial) come to mind.

[BIG SHAFE]

I've also signed a civil agreement to act in accordance with the ORC too. Specifically I can do anything that is not a felony or misdemeanor.

Yeah but I'm not sure how much you can rely on your tacit consent to obey the laws of Ohio in this one.
*EDIT*Not sure if you meant your CHL or not.

I was refering to OC'ing on campus. The ORC has not defined open carry as illegal on college campuses. Since I've signed an agreement to abide by it and their "unless authorized" statement, those two parts of their code are in fact, in conflict of each other.

[Splat!!]

Feltoosj, there sure are a lot of complicated posts here to your question. But none with much common sense. If you want some good advice, and I don't claim to be a expert, but, if you want to stay out of trouble, do not carry on campus, CC or OC. Stay safe.

Hey..........Iam not an expert but, if you don't want to be in an automobile accident, some good advice is don't drive ............Stay safe.

OC on campus, and driving your car. Well thats a great comparison. Duh. Stay safe.

I am not comparing the actions............Duh, I am comparing the use of scare tactics to prevent someone from doing something...........

It's like I tell my wife, say what you mean don't cite possible negative experiences trying to persuade me from my course of action. Just say you do not approve or like the idea . Take your stance and hold it .

[almega]

A "school" (in terms of "school zone") refers to a high/middle/elementary school.

Colleges/universities are different, and as far as I know it would be legal.
<snip>

You are mistaken, it does include colleges and OC would be illegal unless you where otherwise authorized to OC there. I will go find the laws for the sake of this conversation

[almega]

Gun free zone:
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/ ... -000-.html

Summary on wiki:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun-Free_S ... ct_of_1990

Basically it allows the states to define colleges / universities as part of the gun free zone or not, I will have to look in the ORC to see if ohio defines it as such. This would be so much easier if I still worked at LexisNexis

[feltoosj]

Um...nowhere in 18 USC does it say "college" or "university".

From the wiki article: "The term school means a school which provides elementary or secondary education, as determined under State law."

[Splat!!]

It really doesn't specify if a college is a school zone or not , I have never seen a gun/drug free sign posted near a college like they post around our high schools and such.......................................

[almega]

If you read it, it allows the states to define "school" as they see fit, including defining a college / university as a school.

ORC will point you to code, that points you to code, that finally points you to some sort of definition of a school I did the legwork of finding it, you can decipher it lol

(Q) “School” means any school operated by a board of education, any community school established under Chapter 3314. of the Revised Code, or any nonpublic school for which the state board of education prescribes minimum standards under section 3301.07 of the Revised Code, whether or not any instruction, extracurricular activities, or training provided by the school is being conducted at the time a criminal offense is committed.

(R) “School premises” means either of the following:

(1) The parcel of real property on which any school is situated, whether or not any instruction, extracurricular activities, or training provided by the school is being conducted on the premises at the time a criminal offense is committed;

(2) Any other parcel of real property that is owned or leased by a board of education of a school, the governing authority of a community school established under Chapter 3314. of the Revised Code, or the governing body of a nonpublic school for which the state board of education prescribes minimum standards under section 3301.07 of the Revised Code and on which some of the instruction, extracurricular activities, or training of the school is conducted, whether or not any instruction, extracurricular activities, or training provided by the school is being conducted on the parcel of real property at the time a criminal offense is committed.

It would seem that Ohio does not define "school" to include a college, but others can (and have as far as i can tell).

I would do more to look up the laws as to see if colleges are sepcifically enumerated but I need to get back to work and I just dont care that much

Either way, telling someone that OC is legal on a college campus seems foolish to me.

[feltoosj]

To my knowledge, a college is not run by a board of education but rather a board of trustees.

[BIG SHAFE]

TITLE 18 > PART I > CHAPTER 44 > § 921Prev Next § 921.

Definitions(26) The term “school” means a school which provides elementary or secondary education, as determined under State law

No mention of colleges.

2901.01 General provisions definitions.

(C) As used in Title XXIX of the Revised Code:

(1) “School safety zone” consists of a school, school building, school premises, school activity, and school bus.

(2) “School,” “school building,” and “school premises” have the same meanings as in section 2925.01 of the Revised Code.

CHAPTER 2925: DRUG OFFENSES

(Q) “School” means any school operated by a board of education, any community school established under Chapter 3314. of the Revised Code, or any nonpublic school for which the state board of education prescribes minimum standards under section 3301.07 of the Revised Code, whether or not any instruction, extracurricular activities, or training provided by the school is being conducted at the time a criminal offense is committed.

I'm fairly certain the State can not and does not set standards for colleges. They have accreditations.

CHAPTER 3314: COMMUNITY SCHOOLS

3314.012 Development of report cards.

(D) Report cards shall be distributed to the parents of all students in the community school, to the members of the board of education of the school district in which the community school is located, and to any person who requests one from the department

3314.06 Admission procedures.

(E) That the school may not limit admission to students on the basis of intellectual ability, measures of achievement or aptitude, or athletic ability, except that a school may limit its enrollment to students as described in division (B) of this section.

Grade transcripts at colleges can only be sent to the person to who is enrolled.

Admission to colleges can be rejected for levels of intellectual, athletic, etc. abilities.

[Splat!!]

You beat me to it............. shafe.

So by orc and federal it appears that colleges and such are not schools as defined for the gunfree zones and they are in most part a private business which can forbid firearms with proper postings and verbal warnings...................Same as any other business..

Also in the reading it appears if the public school system allows CCW by teachers in a contract agreement , It is legal so really the school board holds that card........

)

if the individual possessing the firearm is licensed to do so by the State in which the school zone is located or a political subdivision of the State, and the law of the State or political subdivision requires that, before an individual obtains such a license, the law enforcement authorities of the State or political subdivision verify that the individual is qualified under law to receive the license;
(iii) that is—
(I) not loaded; and
(II) in a locked container, or a locked firearms rack that is on a motor vehicle;
(iv) by an individual for use in a program approved by a school in the school zone;
(v) by an individual in accordance with a contract entered into between a school in the school zone and the individual or an employer of the individual;
(vi) by a law enforcement officer acting in his or her official capacity; or
(vii) that is unloaded and is possessed by an individual while traversing school premises for the purpose of gaining access to public or private lands open to hunting, if the entry on school premises is authorized by school authorities.

Edit....Unless Ohio has law preventing it.

[ParatrooperJJ]

A "school" (in terms of "school zone") refers to a high/middle/elementary school.

Colleges/universities are different, and as far as I know it would be legal.
<snip>

You are mistaken, it does include colleges and OC would be illegal unless you where otherwise authorized to OC there. I will go find the laws for the sake of this conversation

Incorrect. Feltoosj is correct. "School" only applies to elementary - high schools.