ATF proposes new bump stock rule

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ATF proposes new bump stock rule

Post by lionsfan »

If you don't like this new proposed rule, you have until June 27 2018 to comment.

https://www.federalregister.gov/documen ... dium=email" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: ATF proposes new bump stock rule

Post by WY_Not »

Followed the link and it says no longer open for comment.
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Re: ATF proposes new bump stock rule

Post by bignflnut »

After claiming public safety enhancements due to this action, even justifying the action on that basis:
Alternative 3—Opportunity alternatives. Based on public comments, individuals wishing to replicate the effects of bump-stock-type devices could also use rubber bands, belt loops, or otherwise train their trigger finger to fire more rapidly. To the extent that individuals are capable of doing so, this would be their alternative to using bump-stock-type devices.
Ooooh. The criminals can't be given pants or rubber bands!
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Re: ATF proposes new bump stock rule

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WY_Not wrote:Followed the link and it says no longer open for comment.
I just checked and was open for me. I already made my comment this morning.
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Re: ATF proposes new bump stock rule

Post by WY_Not »

*shrugs* 'ell if I know. It opens now. Earlier this morning I got a pop up saying it was closed.
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Re: ATF proposes new bump stock rule

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Heavy traffic perhaps?

I don't think they were prepared for 30000 responses on the :P 1st day
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Re: ATF proposes new bump stock rule

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Here's hoping there is massive non-compliance if this is rammed through.
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Re: ATF proposes new bump stock rule

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Non-compliance is absolutely an issue and is exacerbated by no compensation. Also, strange nefarious :shock: types may actually be more inclinded to turn them in, if there is a bounty to be paid say, $1500. As with all bans, it sounds good on paper until its discovered that in the haste of writing quickly (as I described on a mirrored thread here at OCCWF) the DoJers didn't think it all through to the end; many ppl will say '' no dinero, no turn in''. Or in simplified terms they are at the good graces of John Q Public to comply, and believe they will ; yet simultaneously distrust same persons to keep them. It's 2nd grade allll over again and the daisy flower, ''she loves me, she loves me not. She...'' or , ''I believe them, believe them not, be...''
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Re: ATF proposes new bump stock rule

Post by WY_Not »

Even if there were compensation, hopefully there is massive non-compliance.
WhyNot wrote:Non-compliance is absolutely an issue and is exacerbated by no compensation. Also, strange nefarious :shock: types may actually be more inclinded to turn them in, if there is a bounty to be paid say, $1500. As with all bans, it sounds good on paper until its discovered that in the haste of writing quickly (as I described on a mirrored thread here at OCCWF) the DoJers didn't think it all through to the end; many ppl will say '' no dinero, no turn in''. Or in simplified terms they are at the good graces of John Q Public to comply, and believe they will ; yet simultaneously distrust same persons to keep them. It's 2nd grade allll over again and the daisy flower, ''she loves me, she loves me not. She...'' or , ''I believe them, believe them not, be...''
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Re: ATF proposes new bump stock rule

Post by bignflnut »

Slide Fire Solutions, the inventor and manufacturer of bump stocks, will no longer be selling the firearm accessories.

On its website Tuesday, Slide Fire Solutions said it "will cease taking orders for its products and shut down its website."

The company said it will process and ship all orders taken prior to May 20. The company did not say on its website what will happen to its factory in Texas.

SNIP

A company called Fostech used to sell them, but no longer does so. Bump Fire Systems, which was reportedly sued for patent infringement by Slide Fire in 2016, still lists the items on its web site. They're also sold by the online retailer, Gunbroker.com.

SNIP

The National Shooting Sports Foundation, the gun industry group, declined to comment.
Will there be a march of the plastics, where people bring their detached bump-stocks to the streets?? Nah, that would be too Boston Tea Party for people.

How quickly will the 3D printer market toss these into the world? The government simply cannot regulate them, because the technology has surpassed them...yet they persist.
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Re: ATF proposes new bump stock rule

Post by bignflnut »

ATF claims that they don't need to know how many crimes are committed with bump stocks, in direct response to a FOIA request for that data.
This is a power-grab by the executive branch that will set the tone for this and future administrations to arbitrarily change definitions, impose bans with destruction/surrender orders and turn non-compliant citizens into felons, all while bypassing Congress.

It’s not hard to imagine what a Democrat president would do if such power becomes the accepted norm. It's not hard to imagine them taking full and gleeful advantage of it, with fawning media support and no shortage of appointed-for-life activist federal judges eager to rule in favor of infringements.

That’s despite the Trump administration's new efforts and justifications contradicting not just what ATF/DOJ previously stated in rulings, but what they just last year asserted in federal court and argued to a judge.

From their position as stated on July 27, 2017:

“Bump firing is the process of using the recoil of a semiautomatic firearm to fire in rapid succession, simulating the effect of an automatic firearm when performed with a high level of skill and precision by the shooter… The rapid fire sequence in bump firing is contingent on shooter input, rather than mechanical input, and thus cannot shoot automatically”

From their position as stated on Sept. 13, 2017 (scroll to page 8):

ecause of the manual, skill based methods required to operate a bump fire device they are not machineguns.”

What has changed? Besides a political position ordered by superiors who would not be qualified to intern at the Firearms Technology Branch…? Essentially, the FTB's supposedly science/physics-based position is being politically overridden.
“It’s not that we don’t have enough scoundrels to curse; it’s that we don’t have enough good men to curse them.”–G.K. Chesterton-Illustrated London News, 3-14-1908

Republicans.Hate.You. See2020.

"Avarice, ambition, revenge and licentiousness would break the strongest cords of our Constitution, as a whale goes through a net. Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other." John Adams to Mass Militia 10-11-1798
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Re: ATF proposes new bump stock rule

Post by bignflnut »

GOA calling Trump out...
Mr. President, during your presidential campaign, you promised that you would be a champion of Second Amendment rights. After the 2016 Pulse Nightclub shooting in Florida, you wisely recognized that “if you had one person in that room that could carry a gun and knew how to use it, it wouldn’t have happened, or certainly to the extent that it did. In your campaign platform, you correctly acknowledged that “bans are a total failure. That’s been proven every time it’s been tried. ... Law-abiding people should be allowed to own the firearm of their choice. The government has no business dictating what types of firearms good, honest people are allowed to own.” And, in 2017, you promised that “an ‘eight-year assault’ on gun ownership rights had come to a ‘crashing end’....”

Unfortunately, Mr. President, it now appears that —under your administration —gun owners’ rights are under a greater threat than at any time in recent history. Gun owners were called paranoid for thinking President Obama was coming for their guns
—yet you have now announced that you quite literally are coming for their guns. On behalf of Gun Owners of
America, I call upon you to stand true to your promises to protect Americans’ Second Amendment rights.

Mr. President, I would remind you that those who wish to regulate bump stocks are not part of your “base”
—the ones who elected you to office. You will accomplish nothing by supporting so-called “reasonable regulations.” The anti
-gun left will not be appeased by your proposals. Rather, they will only feel emboldened to further trample our rights.

Mr. President, among the Americans who elected you to office were Gun Owners of America’s members. They are often single
-issue voters, and they have good memories. They will not tolerate a President who compromises their constitutional rights, just because he felt that “something had to be done” to respond to the latest mass shooting.
“It’s not that we don’t have enough scoundrels to curse; it’s that we don’t have enough good men to curse them.”–G.K. Chesterton-Illustrated London News, 3-14-1908

Republicans.Hate.You. See2020.

"Avarice, ambition, revenge and licentiousness would break the strongest cords of our Constitution, as a whale goes through a net. Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other." John Adams to Mass Militia 10-11-1798
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Re: ATF proposes new bump stock rule

Post by bignflnut »

You’re at the range, shooting your legally-acquired AR-15 when an ATF agent puts you in handcuffs, takes away your gun, and tells you you’re under arrest for owning a “machine gun.”

That may sound crazy now, but if the ATF’s proposed rule change designed to ban “bump stocks” and other devices designed to “increase the rate of fire” on a firearm goes into effect, that very well could happen. That’s because the rule doesn’t just ban bump stocks, it changes the definition of what a “machine gun” is.

SNIP

While the language specifically states that it includes “bump-stock type devices,” it doesn’t keep it at that, which to many gun owners, is bad enough. Instead, it goes on to describe what a bump stock is. Under that definition, any “device” that can harness “the recoil energy of a semiautomatic firearm” to allow it to continue firing “without additional physical manipulation of the trigger by the shooter” would be considered a machine gun.

What else could be used to do that? A rubber band, a belt loop, and even a shoelace.

With that knowledge, going back to the beginning of the machine gun definition is important. The term “readily restored to shoot” creates a dangerous precedent. Under an anti-gun administration, that term could be used to justify the banning of any semi-automatic firearm, as virtually every semi-automatic firearm can be “readily restored to shoot” at a rate which meets the definition of a “machine gun” simply by using a belt loop with a little ingenuity.

So wearing pants with belt loops, while holding an AR-15 could meet the definition, as the belt loop is readily available.
I suppose we should be happy when Cinti or other municipalities actually name and ban an accessory, because, it's rather specific that way, huh?
“It’s not that we don’t have enough scoundrels to curse; it’s that we don’t have enough good men to curse them.”–G.K. Chesterton-Illustrated London News, 3-14-1908

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"Avarice, ambition, revenge and licentiousness would break the strongest cords of our Constitution, as a whale goes through a net. Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other." John Adams to Mass Militia 10-11-1798
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Re: ATF proposes new bump stock rule

Post by bignflnut »

The problem for regulators is that there isn't a record of who owns them, so they've had to rely on citizens voluntarily turning in their bump stocks to comply with the law.

Massachusetts and New Jersey are both heavily liberal States, and yet virtually nobody turned in their bump stocks. Only three people did in Massachusetts, while a total of zero did in New Jersey.

Bump stock bans are currently awaiting governor's signatures in Hawaii and Connecticut, and Delaware and Rhode Island are set to ban them soon too. A gun control proponent may argue that despite the impossibility of confiscating all the current bump stocks in circulation, a ban on sales prevents the supply from growing.

Regardless, the real lesson here is that any gun confiscation schemes the Left may cook up would never be obeyed if attempted. If gun owners in far-left States won't even turn in a gun accessory, what could of gun control measure would owners comply with?
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“It’s not that we don’t have enough scoundrels to curse; it’s that we don’t have enough good men to curse them.”–G.K. Chesterton-Illustrated London News, 3-14-1908

Republicans.Hate.You. See2020.

"Avarice, ambition, revenge and licentiousness would break the strongest cords of our Constitution, as a whale goes through a net. Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other." John Adams to Mass Militia 10-11-1798
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Re: ATF proposes new bump stock rule

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Learn how Project Appleseed is supporting freedom through Marksmanship and Heritage clinics.
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