Shootout

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Willy P
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Location: Madison Co.

Shootout

Post by Willy P »

Anyone watch the History Channel? Ever watch Shootout? Tonight they covered the North Hollywood shootout back in 97. Yes they hollywooded it up some but there was a lot of fact left in and the footage brought back memories I have of it when it was happening. One thing I never knew. In 93 the two shooters were arrested with full auto weapons, found guilty and put in jail. Oh yeah they were paroled in months and petitioned to get the weapons back! and did get them back! Is this a wonderful country or what? The shootout lasted something like 45 minutes and I have forgotten how many thousand rounds between all involved. One of the shooters hand sewed a kevlar suit that covered him from ankle to wrist to neck. He either NDed himself in the end or headshot himself on purpose just as an LEO neck shot him. It was chilling at the time it happened but as they told details tonight is was even more so to me. The knowledge it could happen again pretty easily is pretty unnerving to me.
Petrovich
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Post by Petrovich »

I've seen that footage several times myself. In one version the narrator said the second shooter shot himself. In another version the narrator said a swat sniper got him in the head.

The way he dropped, it sure seemed like a head shot to me. I've shot hogs for butchering and they drop the exact same way...just like a sack of mud.

I still can't believe for all the fire those two expended they didn't manage (thankfully) to kill anyone.
Ursus americanus
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Post by Ursus americanus »

What gets me is the anti-assault weapons arguement uses this as an example of cops being out gunned. One scoped Savage in 223 could have taken out both of these thugs.

Give me the afore mentioned hunting rifle against these two thugs with semi-auto's and guess who walks away and who doesn't?
Buckshot
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Post by Buckshot »

Some of those old time LAPD cops with their 6" Combat Masterpieces (Adam 12 TV show period. Long barreled .38 Specials and still qualifying clear back to 50 yds.) could have taken care of it if any had still been around.

Buckshot
Petrovich
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Post by Petrovich »

Both of those guy were wearing body armor and had been hit several times.
Willy P
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Post by Willy P »

I watched the show a second time. Those two locos put out around 1100 rounds out of 2 AKs, 1 AR, and an HK in 308 and one or two 9 mil pistols in about a 45 minute span of eternity! One of the SWAT officers called it "spray and pray" fire. That counted the one round that one of them put through the top of his head either on purpose or by accident trying to reload his pistol weakhand when the other arm had taken a bullet to the wrist/hand area.
Buckshot
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Post by Buckshot »

Petrofergov wrote:Both of those guy were wearing body armor and had been hit several times.
P4G,

I would guess this is in reply to my comment about the old time LAPD officers with the 6" Combat Masterpieces?

In general, how do you take down a bad guy in body armor? Like with a "failure to stop" drill? the FTS drill teaches two to the body, evaluate, one to the head, but I would change that to simply "shoot the unarmored area".

Remember that the cops I mentioned were carrying 6" revolvers and still had to qualify at 50 yards at the time?

Those guys would not have had any real trouble with head or neck hits from across the street into the parking lot or on the sidewalk, both of which were less than 50 yards per some of the detailed analyses printed at the time.

The average "spray and pray" cop with a Beretta 92 who only shoots it at 7 or 15 yards could not have done it with a pistol, but some of the well trained older oficers with the right equipment could have easily made shots through seams in the armor that are required if you are going to move wearing it.

Buckshot
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