Head of Security

Use this forum to post your experience with encounters with law enforcement, criminals, or other encounters as a result of your firearm or potential to be carrying one.

Moderators: Coordinators, Moderators

Head of Security

Postby Javelin Man » Tue Jan 02, 2018 8:41 am

I took a day trip last week to University Circle near Cleveland and went into the Crawford Auto-Aviation Museum. I saw no signs on the doors but figured it was a CPZ anyway so I left the S&W in the car. As the family was walking around, we finally found the AMX prototype I had been seeking to find. :) As I was gazing upon it, a senior fellow walked up with a name badge and he introduced himself, first by name, then by title of Head of Security, then bluntly asked if I was carrying. I assured him I was not and he was satisfied, never asked to see my CHL or any other information. He said he was contacted by someone else who saw my holster poking out from under my flannel shirt just a bit.

He was friendly and very courteous and professional. I only missed asking him what would have happened if I was carrying.

After that, we went to the Cleveland Art Museum. After an hour or so, I noticed museum docents or volunteers were always keeping an eye on me. At one point I was talking to my wife and made a noticeable motion to turn and face a badged person who was trying to remain inconspicuous around a pillar. He finally turned and walked away. That was pretty much the last one to do so, after that they kept their distance.
Famous last words: "I just drank What?!-Socrates

bruh bruh is slang for "complete and total moron" -sodbuster95

The following is a list of children's books that didn't quite make it to the printing press...
1. What Is That Dog Doing to That Other Dog?
2. Daddy Drinks Because You Cry
3. You Were An Accident
4. Bi-Curious George
Javelin Man
OFCC Member
OFCC Member
 
Posts: 6681
Joined: Fri Aug 19, 2005 4:53 pm
Location: Sandusky County

Re: Head of Security

Postby Brian D. » Tue Jan 02, 2018 12:28 pm

Duluth Trading Company sells longer tailed shirts. As do several other vendors. Just saying, it's pointless to be home in on because your holster was visible.
Quit worrying, hide your gun well, shut up, and CARRY that handgun!

********************************************************************************
1911 and Browning Hi Power Enthusianado.
Brian D.
 
Posts: 14348
Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2005 8:42 pm
Location: SW Ohio

Re: Head of Security

Postby JustaShooter » Tue Jan 02, 2018 2:25 pm

Why did you figure it was a CPZ? It doesn't appear to be on university property, nor does it look like it is a government facility. So, unless posted...

I do wish you'd have thought to ask what would have happened if you'd been carrying though.
Christian, Husband, Father
NRA Life Member
NRA Certified Range Safety Officer
NRA Certified Pistol & Rifle Instructor

Want to become more active with OFCC and help fight for your rights? Click Here!
User avatar
JustaShooter
OFCC Coordinator
OFCC Coordinator
 
Posts: 4253
Joined: Thu Feb 07, 2013 3:08 pm
Location: Akron/Canton Area

Re: Head of Security

Postby rimfireOH » Tue Jan 02, 2018 2:51 pm

The Cleveland Art Museum is NOT posted on their pretty, main-entrance, all-glass doors (that I've been able to see).
The Cleveland Botanical Gardens is NOT posted on their pretty, main-entrance, all-glass doors (that I've been able to see).

I don't know about the other museums in that area first hand.

One of my pet-peeves (outside notification) (and inconsistency in school-property laws) is inconsistency in posting. If you're going to post ONE door, you should be required to post ALL of them. ALL of them.
I don't want to have to prove that I went in the one door they didn't post...
User avatar
rimfireOH
OFCC Member
OFCC Member
 
Posts: 294
Joined: Fri Dec 27, 2013 9:49 am
Location: NE Ohio

Re: Head of Security

Postby djthomas » Tue Jan 02, 2018 2:57 pm

JustaShooter wrote:I do wish you'd have thought to ask what would have happened if you'd been carrying though.

I doubt it would be "pat on the back and free lifetime passes." If security is asking I'm 95% sure he's going to be asked to leave or take it to his car. The other 5% would tell him to cover up better. If the latter were the case here I would have expected them to still ask Javelin to cover up better since the holster apparently attracted notice.

Letting it drop was probably a wise thing; maybe it will stay unposted to the benefit of those that can conceal better. If it was a more memorable conversation he might make a note to get a sign put up.

I've never been made but I've been near somebody that has been. Funny enough it occurred in a museum though in a state where almost nothing is posted because signs have no real force of law. I noticed the guy long before security did. They tactfully let him know that weapons were prohibited on the premises and if he'd return it to his vehicle they'd get him back into the exhibit without having to wait in line again. As far as I know he did just that because I saw leave and then meet up with his group about 20 minutes later. Never saw/heard them ask for a permit or anything like that.
Never ask if you can carry at a non-posted place, but always ask why you cannot at one that is!
Just because they offer call ahead seating doesn't mean you call ahead for carry permission.
User avatar
djthomas
 
Posts: 5723
Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2006 11:09 am
Location: Medina County

Re: Head of Security

Postby Brian D. » Tue Jan 02, 2018 4:03 pm

I was intending to be a little glib with my answer above, by the way. But djthomas's input reminded me of an acquaintance who pretty much always has the bottom of his OWB holster showing past the tail of his shirt or jacket. He grudgingly admits it's caused him to be "made" and then asked to leave a few places that were posted. And of course, that's why I ride this guy: He spends money in CPZ establishments when there are other choices available.
Quit worrying, hide your gun well, shut up, and CARRY that handgun!

********************************************************************************
1911 and Browning Hi Power Enthusianado.
Brian D.
 
Posts: 14348
Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2005 8:42 pm
Location: SW Ohio

Re: Head of Security

Postby carmen fovozzo » Tue Jan 02, 2018 5:07 pm

What do you do with you're gun when you took it off ? A couple seconds more and you could remove you're gun with the holster...safer.....I know you know that.
Life is full of God given coincidences..
A MEMBER OF OFCC SINCE 2004...
carmen fovozzo
OFCC Patron Member
OFCC Patron Member
 
Posts: 18119
Joined: Mon Jan 29, 2007 11:08 am
Location: NEO

Re: Head of Security

Postby Javelin Man » Tue Jan 02, 2018 8:59 pm

carmen fovozzo wrote:What do you do with you're gun when you took it off ? A couple seconds more and you could remove you're gun with the holster...safer.....I know you know that.


My holster is in the belt so I'd have to really twist and move things around to keep the gun in the holster, especially in the winter months. I left the gun inside the glove compartment. I have to balance safety with near-impossibility.

As for the holster showing, I tend to be more casual about a piece of leather when it's not holding a firearm.
Famous last words: "I just drank What?!-Socrates

bruh bruh is slang for "complete and total moron" -sodbuster95

The following is a list of children's books that didn't quite make it to the printing press...
1. What Is That Dog Doing to That Other Dog?
2. Daddy Drinks Because You Cry
3. You Were An Accident
4. Bi-Curious George
Javelin Man
OFCC Member
OFCC Member
 
Posts: 6681
Joined: Fri Aug 19, 2005 4:53 pm
Location: Sandusky County

Re: Head of Security

Postby M-Quigley » Tue Jan 02, 2018 9:14 pm

I couldn't find anything about restrictions on their website except cameras with external flash is not permitted, and some other photography related restrictions.
M-Quigley
 
Posts: 2355
Joined: Wed Jun 24, 2015 10:06 pm
Location: Western Ohio

Re: Head of Security

Postby ashtabula » Wed Jan 03, 2018 7:59 am

Just a general warning. One wants to be very careful in the University Circle area. Case Western owns a lot of property in the area that display no outward sign that the property belongs to the university. There are many homes, parking lots and fields that are university property. At one time they owned the building housing the liquor store at E. 55th and Euclid. I would stay on the sidewalk along the road, no shortcuts through parking lots or fields. If a university cop finds you armed on university property, they are not going to let it go and just tell you to leave.
ashtabula
 
Posts: 133
Joined: Fri Feb 06, 2015 11:06 am

Re: Head of Security

Postby djthomas » Wed Jan 03, 2018 8:36 am

ashtabula wrote:If a university cop finds you armed on university property, they are not going to let it go and just tell you to leave.

They kind of have to, after optionally writing a minor misdemeanor citation.
Never ask if you can carry at a non-posted place, but always ask why you cannot at one that is!
Just because they offer call ahead seating doesn't mean you call ahead for carry permission.
User avatar
djthomas
 
Posts: 5723
Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2006 11:09 am
Location: Medina County

Re: Head of Security

Postby Brian D. » Wed Jan 03, 2018 9:47 am

djthomas wrote:
ashtabula wrote:If a university cop finds you armed on university property, they are not going to let it go and just tell you to leave.

They kind of have to, after optionally writing a minor misdemeanor citation.


Still though, it's pretty annoying to not have any idea just whose property you might be on. Sometimes even a good search of public records leaves me scratching my head.
Quit worrying, hide your gun well, shut up, and CARRY that handgun!

********************************************************************************
1911 and Browning Hi Power Enthusianado.
Brian D.
 
Posts: 14348
Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2005 8:42 pm
Location: SW Ohio

Re: Head of Security

Postby carmen fovozzo » Wed Jan 03, 2018 9:48 am

Javelin Man wrote:
carmen fovozzo wrote:What do you do with you're gun when you took it off ? A couple seconds more and you could remove you're gun with the holster...safer.....I know you know that.


My holster is in the belt so I'd have to really twist and move things around to keep the gun in the holster, especially in the winter months. I left the gun inside the glove compartment. I have to balance safety with near-impossibility.

As for the holster showing, I tend to be more casual about a piece of leather when it's not holding a firearm.


That's why I use a paddle holster.
Life is full of God given coincidences..
A MEMBER OF OFCC SINCE 2004...
carmen fovozzo
OFCC Patron Member
OFCC Patron Member
 
Posts: 18119
Joined: Mon Jan 29, 2007 11:08 am
Location: NEO

Re: Head of Security

Postby ashtabula » Wed Jan 03, 2018 9:57 am

Learn something new every day. I would have thought carrying a concealed weapon on a college campus would rate higher than minor misdemeanor. Has this changed recently, or has it always been this way?
ashtabula
 
Posts: 133
Joined: Fri Feb 06, 2015 11:06 am

Re: Head of Security

Postby djthomas » Wed Jan 03, 2018 10:57 am

ashtabula wrote:Learn something new every day. I would have thought carrying a concealed weapon on a college campus would rate higher than minor misdemeanor. Has this changed recently, or has it always been this way?

It changed last year in March when colleges were given the authority to allow CCW. At the same time the penalty for those carrying without permission (but with a CHL) was dropped to an MM for a first offense if the property is owned by a college or university. Subsequent offenses are more severe but it's never higher than an M2.

Brian D. wrote:Still though, it's pretty annoying to not have any idea just whose property you might be on. Sometimes even a good search of public records leaves me scratching my head.

Absolutely. With it being an MM one could probably get it dropped or changed to disorderly conduct by arguing the "knowingly" aspect unless it was a very obvious university place such as a quad between college buildings or a college building itself.

Nonetheless it's a potential hassle.
Never ask if you can carry at a non-posted place, but always ask why you cannot at one that is!
Just because they offer call ahead seating doesn't mean you call ahead for carry permission.
User avatar
djthomas
 
Posts: 5723
Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2006 11:09 am
Location: Medina County

Next

Return to Real Life Encounters

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests