AZ tells armed drivers how to avoid deadly police stops

[AlanM]

Title tells it all:
Arizona tells armed drivers how to avoid deadly police stops

[glocksmith]

While they are at it, they should tell police officers how to avoid deadly police stops...too. After all, it takes two to make a deadly encounter.

[bignflnut]

The new edition of the driver’s manual, published about a month ago, advises drivers with guns to keep their hands on the steering wheel during traffic stops and tell officers right away that there’s a firearm in the car.

It also tells drivers not to reach for anything inside the vehicle without getting permission first. And officers can take possession of guns, for safety reasons, until the stop is completed. The firearms would be returned if no crime has been committed.

AKA "How to properly prostrate yourself before your master"

Illegal / lethal to scare a State official, don'tchaknow.

“It all comes down to safety,” said Quentin Mehr, a spokesman for the state police agency.

Who's safety, Quentin? The individual who can "legally" touch/use/KEEP/BEAR his weapon, or somebody else?

In a vehicle transporting 4 adult males, only one has a steering wheel to prostrate himself on. What would master have the other three adult males do to properly prostrate themselves? Are they not threats to the felt security of the pair of officers? Even though they're all wearing jerseys and hats of the local home team, would they be instantly accused to running drugs, public intoxication, or some other such crime?

[deanimator]

I've got an idea so crazy it might just work!

How about if the police stop creating "crises" that require "split second decisions", then shooting their way out of them.

If they did THAT, there's a good chance that Philando Castile wouldn't have been killed and Levar Jones wouldn't have been shot.

Just to clarify, don't tell somebody to do something then shoot them for doing it in a completely foreseeable way.

[High Power]

I've got an idea so crazy it might just work!

How about if the police stop creating "crises" that require "split second decisions", then shooting their way out of them.

If they did THAT, there's a good chance that Philando Castile wouldn't have been killed and Levar Jones wouldn't have been shot.

Just to clarify, don't tell somebody to do something then shoot them for doing it in a completely foreseeable way.

Bingo! I couldn't have said it any better. Why don't they train the officers to act more responsibly? 99% of the gun owners aren't criminals. The LEOs need to realize that.

[bignflnut]

99% of the gun owners aren't criminals. The LEOs need to realize that.

In support of this point...

A Crime Prevention Research Center (CPRC) study shows that concealed carry permit holders are among the most law-abiding of law-abiding citizens in the country.

For example, for 2016 the study shows that just .0092% of Louisiana permit holders were charged with a felony in 2016. And in 2015 there “were 25,208 violent crimes in Louisiana, with 19 felony charges or convictions against permit holders.” Assuming the felonies were violent and the charges against permit holders stand, this still means permit holders only represent .08% of those who committed violent crimes.

Moreover, “the vast majority of … [cases involving concealed permit holders] are unlikely to involve firearms.”

According to CPRC, the percentage of Michigan concealed permit holders convicted of aggravated assault in 2015-2016 was .003%. The percentage of Michigan permit holders convicted of aggravated assaults in 2014-2015 was .002%

[High Power]

99% of the gun owners aren't criminals. The LEOs need to realize that.

In support of this point...

A Crime Prevention Research Center (CPRC) study shows that concealed carry permit holders are among the most law-abiding of law-abiding citizens in the country.

For example, for 2016 the study shows that just .0092% of Louisiana permit holders were charged with a felony in 2016. And in 2015 there “were 25,208 violent crimes in Louisiana, with 19 felony charges or convictions against permit holders.” Assuming the felonies were violent and the charges against permit holders stand, this still means permit holders only represent .08% of those who committed violent crimes.

Moreover, “the vast majority of … [cases involving concealed permit holders] are unlikely to involve firearms.”

According to CPRC, the percentage of Michigan concealed permit holders convicted of aggravated assault in 2015-2016 was .003%. The percentage of Michigan permit holders convicted of aggravated assaults in 2014-2015 was .002%

Thank you!

When the LEOs start harassing gun owners and CHL holders (even shooting them) then I may not be inclined to help an officer in trouble if I see it. Why should I put myself in jeopardy when law abiding gun owners have been harassed and shot by those that are supposed to "protect and to serve?"

Think about this. An armed citizen could be a hero one day if he helps a LEO in a shoot-out. Then the next day gets harassed by some jerk on the force for open-carrying in a city park. Rational people would have to ask themselves if it's worth risking their lives for a police force that may be pitted against them?

If you don't think that's possible then ask yourselves about how many times in the past that you have gone out of your way to help a person or group of people then when you need help from them; they don't remember who you are.

I got hassled once by a LEO and I didn't do anything wrong. He was a complete jerk and threatened to arrest me. He finally backed off when I told him that I wasn't talking with him anymore and if he wasn't going to arrest me than I am free to go.

He was such an intimidating jerk that I don't think I would come to his aid if a BG was getting the best of him at a traffic stop. I would probably call 911 and video everything with my smart phone but why should I risk getting hurt over a jerk who didn't care about the truth or my rights?

If the state is going to "educate" gun owners about how to behave during a traffic stop they also need to "educate" the LEOs making the traffic stop and remind them that they aren't God. They can't shoot first and ask questions later.

[JU-87]

I've got an idea so crazy it might just work!

How about if the police stop creating "crises" that require "split second decisions", then shooting their way out of them.

If they did THAT, there's a good chance that Philando Castile wouldn't have been killed and Levar Jones wouldn't have been shot.

Just to clarify, don't tell somebody to do something then shoot them for doing it in a completely foreseeable way.

WOW. Well written.
I am becoming a "deanimator" fan!

[JU-87]

When the LEOs start harassing gun owners and CHL holders (even shooting them) then I may not be inclined to help an officer in trouble if I see it. Why should I put myself in jeopardy when law abiding gun owners have been harassed and shot by those that are supposed to "protect and to serve?"...

...but why should I risk getting hurt over a jerk who didn't care about the truth or my rights?

I would'nt help a Cop. NOT MY JOB MAN!!! (I know it's not his "job" to protect me as an individual) I think I would just video it, and be a good witness.

I believe I would have to fight a strong "impulse " to help...but really, why incure the "liability"? Officer Harless is too recent in my memory...