FL man killed when LEOs knock at wrong house

[carmen fovozzo]

They have 4 Deputy's serving warrants.....I would think in this case all 4 would of been there, after all it was a attempted murder warrant....Just guessing though..

You don't send someone in harms way with out knowing the consequences if your under manned.

[dynamike]

I watched a movie set in the mid nineteenth century. Oh how times have changed.

[steves 50de]

Sure seam's lately that their is not enough recon in making sure they have the correct house.If you bust in the wrong house at 130 am be it a leo that dose not identitfy or criminal you should expect to receive fire from the owner.

[carmen fovozzo]

I didn't see any where that Castle Doctrine doesn't apply to LE ? Did I miss it...?

[Beskar'gam]

I didn't see any where that Castle Doctrine doesn't apply to LE ? Did I miss it...?

Interesting theory...no, they can't possibly have left that out of the law...ya think?!

[Cruiser]

We all know what would have happened if the home owner had gotten a shot off first! The LEO would have emptied their weapons oin him!

[Cmazzac]

We all know what would have happened if the home owner had gotten a shot off first! The LEO would have emptied their weapons oin him!

What's it matter he died anyway... It seems that laws are bent to make LEO's lives more safe on the job at the price of restricting citizens constitutional rights. I'm sorry that being a cop is a dangerous job, and unfortunately they don't get the respect and appreciation they deserve but if they do not identify themselves when unlawfully entering a persons home in the night they created an avoidable situation that shouldn't go unpunished. It's funny that George Zimmerman is being prosecuted for this very thing but police once again get off with a paid vacation to deal with the trauma from the shooting where they killed an innocent man in his home. Wonder if his family will get a paid vacation to deal with the stress of his murder?

That was sarcasm

[dynamike]

It's police cover up in incidents like this that cause lawmakers to pass legislation like this -> http://www.in.gov/legislative/bills/201 ... 001.1.html

[BobK]

I am leaving the whole LEO side of the coin out of this, as it has already been discussed, and want to focus solely on the homeowners actions. After all, I can visualize myself being in those circumstances and it is useful to consider a "lessons learned" perspective.

The homeowner made a tactical error when he opened the door. If the door was broken in, he made a strategic error when he neglected to harden his door.

A better approach would have been to be behind a hardened entry speaking to the police via intercomm and CCTV. Have them show their badge to the camera and state their badge number. Let them know you'll come out to speak with them as soon as you verify LEO status with 911. You'll also have video/audio of the encounter.

Bottom line, anyone pointing a firearm at an LEO should expect to have them shoot in today's environment. Wiser to pre-plan to manage the encounter in a way that improves survivability.

[dynamike]

A better approach would have been to be behind a hardened entry speaking to the police via intercomm and CCTV. Have them show their badge to the camera and state their badge number. Let them know you'll come out to speak with them as soon as you verify LEO status with 911. You'll also have video/audio of the encounter.

Some people can't afford that, Bob.

At the very least, the door should stay shut until the identification of the knocker can be verified.

Unfortunately, we only have the officers' story. How can we not be sure he didn't open the door with his firearm at the low-ready or even pointed at the ground by his leg?

[BobK]

Some people can't afford that, Bob.

I am not saying everyone can afford it. I am saying it is a more effective approach.

Given a student budget, what steps would you advise to improve one's survivability?

[JediSkipdogg]

Some people can't afford that, Bob.

I am not saying everyone can afford it. I am saying it is a more effective approach.

Given a student budget, what steps would you advise to improve one's survivability?

FYI....Hamilton County SWAT is certified in the use of C4 shape charges. Got a door that will stop that?

[BobK]

FYI....Hamilton County SWAT is certified in the use of C4 shape charges. Got a door that will stop that?

We're talking about a guy who answered the door for two cops on the front porch, not a full-on SWAT approach.

I cannot survive a full-on SWAT approach unless I completely make myself a non-threat and comply immediately.

[dynamike]

Some people can't afford that, Bob.

I am not saying everyone can afford it. I am saying it is a more effective approach.

Given a student budget, what steps would you advise to improve one's survivability?

Here's what I do:

1. Do not turn off or on any lights or change the volume on any sound producing device. Doing so may possibly alert the person at your door or accomplices that you are indeed in the residence and know someone is at your door.
2. Approach the door armed unholstered at the low ready if necessary.
3. Look into the peephole to identify the person knocking. If you can't see someone in the peephole, carry on. If the person knocking continues to knock and stay in an area you can't see in the peephole, speak to the person through the door to identify him or her and his or her intent. Be sure to stand to the side just in case the person on the other side has a gun and shoots through the door.
4. If the person identifies himself as a police officer, ask for his or her badge number. Call non-emergency to verify the person is indeed an officer and dispatched to your home.
5. Once you've identified the knocker is not an immediate hostile threat, and has legitimate business or you know who the person is and he or she is not a threat, you can open the door.
6. Do not let the person in your home unless you know the person is safe. You can conduct business outside your door. Simply walk outside and shut your door behind you. If the person is an officer and asks to enter for any reason without a warrant, refuse entry.

How's that? Would you amend the list? If so, how?

[marca]

How about if you don't know the person at your door, ignore them.
If they break down your door, shoot them.