SB 199: Active military may carry without CHL

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Re: SB 199: Active military may carry without CHL

Post by JustaShooter »

WY_Not wrote:And even if they are trained in all manner of weapons, they have ZERO training in Ohio CHL law, rules, and regs.
As that isn't required to receive a CHL, and especially now that the training requirement is 8 hours including 2 hours of range time (which happens to line up nicely with the bare-bones NRA Basic Pistol Class) I'll wager there are many Ohioans with CHLs who also "have ZERO training in Ohio CHL law, rules, and regs."
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Re: SB 199: Active military may carry without CHL

Post by buckeye43210 »

JustaShooter wrote:
WY_Not wrote:And even if they are trained in all manner of weapons, they have ZERO training in Ohio CHL law, rules, and regs.
As that isn't required to receive a CHL, and especially now that the training requirement is 8 hours including 2 hours of range time (which happens to line up nicely with the bare-bones NRA Basic Pistol Class) I'll wager there are many Ohioans with CHLs who also "have ZERO training in Ohio CHL law, rules, and regs."
Ohio CHL holders must sign a form that contains the following statement:
I have read the publication that explains Ohio firearms laws, provides instruction in dispute resolution and explains the
Ohio laws related to that matter, and provides information regarding aspects of the use of deadly force with a firearm,
and I am knowledgeable of the provisions of those laws and of the information on those matters.
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Re: SB 199: Active military may carry without CHL

Post by WY_Not »

So putting more people out there with zero training is a good thing? :roll:

At least with the class there is the opportunity to cover such matter or at least to ask questions if the student has at least read the AG's booklet.
JustaShooter wrote:
WY_Not wrote:And even if they are trained in all manner of weapons, they have ZERO training in Ohio CHL law, rules, and regs.
As that isn't required to receive a CHL, and especially now that the training requirement is 8 hours including 2 hours of range time (which happens to line up nicely with the bare-bones NRA Basic Pistol Class) I'll wager there are many Ohioans with CHLs who also "have ZERO training in Ohio CHL law, rules, and regs."
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Re: SB 199: Active military may carry without CHL

Post by Tweed Ring »

I must assume there are scores of Ohioans, who stay with open carry, and who have chosen not to take additional training. While I strongly support additional training, life is replete with choices.
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Re: SB 199: Active military may carry without CHL

Post by SeanC »

JU-87 wrote:I have mixed feelings about this.

After the recent Recruitment Center shooting...YES. How about E-4 and up, O-2 and up. (not O-1's! They are similar to privates.Just more dangerious.)

Should a 17 year old Army E-1, who has 6 months in service, and qualified "Marksman" with a Berretta M9 be able to carry (in uniform) nationwide? Heck NO!

The lack of military "marksmanship" has been discussed here before.

There is too much military worship going on in this proposed law.

Yes, I'm a veteran.
Why are these laws always for "active duty" only? As a reservist, I had the same training as someone on active duty. I've served on active duty in the past--what changes between my last day on active duty and my first day of reserve service that fundamentally changes whether I should need a CHL?

I also have an issue with this because of the problem with school zones. You need a CHL to carry a firearm through a school zone to qualify for the affirmative defense.

I also agree there is too much military worship in this law, and in society, generally. Maybe I'm jaded from being a JAG, but I've seen far too many idiots, miscreants, frankly, "undesirable" people in the military. Some of the most exceptional people I've ever met, and some of my best friends in the world, are in the military, but please don't foster this idea that everyone in the military is an action hero.
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Re: SB 199: Active military may carry without CHL

Post by JustaShooter »

buckeye43210 wrote:
JustaShooter wrote:
WY_Not wrote:And even if they are trained in all manner of weapons, they have ZERO training in Ohio CHL law, rules, and regs.
As that isn't required to receive a CHL, and especially now that the training requirement is 8 hours including 2 hours of range time (which happens to line up nicely with the bare-bones NRA Basic Pistol Class) I'll wager there are many Ohioans with CHLs who also "have ZERO training in Ohio CHL law, rules, and regs."
Ohio CHL holders must sign a form that contains the following statement:
I have read the publication that explains Ohio firearms laws, provides instruction in dispute resolution and explains the
Ohio laws related to that matter, and provides information regarding aspects of the use of deadly force with a firearm,
and I am knowledgeable of the provisions of those laws and of the information on those matters.
Signing a statement that you have read the AG booklet is not the same as receiving training on "Ohio CHL law, rules, and regs."
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Re: SB 199: Active military may carry without CHL

Post by JustaShooter »

WY_Not wrote:
JustaShooter wrote:
WY_Not wrote:And even if they are trained in all manner of weapons, they have ZERO training in Ohio CHL law, rules, and regs.
As that isn't required to receive a CHL, and especially now that the training requirement is 8 hours including 2 hours of range time (which happens to line up nicely with the bare-bones NRA Basic Pistol Class) I'll wager there are many Ohioans with CHLs who also "have ZERO training in Ohio CHL law, rules, and regs."
So putting more people out there with zero training is a good thing? :roll:

At least with the class there is the opportunity to cover such matter or at least to ask questions if the student has at least read the AG's booklet.
Didn't say it was a good thing - but I'll say it really doesn't make a hill of beans worth of difference. If you are a responsible person, you will educate yourself. If you aren't, no amount of classroom time is going to impress it upon you. We supply a link to the AG booklet and tell our students to read it before attending class. The only one I know of who did so before class was my son, because I made sure he did. I've asked many others and without exception they all had excuses as to why they hadn't. I'll not speculate on how many do so before applying. But at a more fundamental level, I am frankly against any government mandated training as a requirement for carrying.
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Re: SB 199: Active military may carry without CHL

Post by WY_Not »

Agree on the mandated training nonsense. Main reason for being against this bill is that it creates yet another class of people with privileges above and beyond the rest of the peasants. Heaven forbid that if they must create yet more useless laws that they apply them equally to everyone, including themselves and their friends. If the law says you must do X, Y, and Z to get a CHL then let that apply to everyone. Quit carving out these little fiefdoms for every stupid, little special interest group. Just because some one served in the military does not mean they should be given a free pass from jumping through the hoops that the rest of us are forced to jump through. Either apply the law to all or apply it to none.

And, yes, I am a veteran.
JustaShooter wrote:Didn't say it was a good thing - but I'll say it really doesn't make a hill of beans worth of difference. If you are a responsible person, you will educate yourself. If you aren't, no amount of classroom time is going to impress it upon you. We supply a link to the AG booklet and tell our students to read it before attending class. The only one I know of who did so before class was my son, because I made sure he did. I've asked many others and without exception they all had excuses as to why they hadn't. I'll not speculate on how many do so before applying. But at a more fundamental level, I am frankly against any government mandated training as a requirement for carrying.
Learn how Project Appleseed is supporting freedom through Marksmanship and Heritage clinics.
Samuel Adams wrote:If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.
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Re: SB 199: Active military may carry without CHL

Post by JustaShooter »

WY_Not wrote:
JustaShooter wrote:Didn't say it was a good thing - but I'll say it really doesn't make a hill of beans worth of difference. If you are a responsible person, you will educate yourself. If you aren't, no amount of classroom time is going to impress it upon you. We supply a link to the AG booklet and tell our students to read it before attending class. The only one I know of who did so before class was my son, because I made sure he did. I've asked many others and without exception they all had excuses as to why they hadn't. I'll not speculate on how many do so before applying. But at a more fundamental level, I am frankly against any government mandated training as a requirement for carrying.
Agree on the mandated training nonsense. Main reason for being against this bill is that it creates yet another class of people with privileges above and beyond the rest of the peasants. Heaven forbid that if they must create yet more useless laws that they apply them equally to everyone, including themselves and their friends. If the law says you must do X, Y, and Z to get a CHL then let that apply to everyone. Quit carving out these little fiefdoms for every stupid, little special interest group. Just because some one served in the military does not mean they should be given a free pass from jumping through the hoops that the rest of us are forced to jump through. Either apply the law to all or apply it to none.

And, yes, I am a veteran.
I agree with you about creating another privileged class of citizen.
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Re: SB 199: Active military may carry without CHL

Post by carmen fovozzo »

In uniform I have no problem with them Carrying Open...if they want to CC I would like to see some training when they are off duty and be required to get a license..a universal license..Why wouldn't we want thousands of are military carrying concealed ? I'd feel safer...if trained with a license...
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Re: SB 199: Active military may carry without CHL

Post by WY_Not »

When they are in uniform doing their job, OC is not an issue. When they take off the uniform, either for the day or upon retirement/discharge, then they are just another citizen. When off duty, uniform or no, then they are just another citizen. Should be the same for LEO's. Let the law be applied equally to all.
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Re: SB 199: Active military may carry without CHL

Post by WestonDon »

Given the recent events in Europe and Africa, I would think this would pass easily. The unintended consequence is that every time something like this is proposed we further validate the States requirement for a license and MANDATEDtraining in the first place. I agree with the poster who opined that the law should apply to everyone equally.
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Re: SB 199: Active military may carry without CHL

Post by carmen fovozzo »

I don't...as a civilian I have a choice...as a person in the military, you have no choice..
....Give our military special treatment until they become civilians..
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Re: SB 199: Active military may carry without CHL

Post by rickt »

Third hearing with a possible committee vote is tomorrow 4/20/2016.
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Re: SB 199: Active military may carry without CHL

Post by buckeye43210 »

Just saw this post over on Facebook:
Are you a Veteran discharged in the last 5-8 years or an active duty service-member based on Ohio? We need your help.

A bill is before the Ohio Senate that allows you to carry a concealed handgun without going through the Ohio licensing process. The only problem is that it also requires you carry proof of your training. Your Military ID isn't enough.

We need help moving an amendment to the bill that changes this. Your Military ID should be enough. We all get sufficient training and don't need to carry around our training records to carry concealed handguns in Ohio.

Please post here or message me if you are willing and able to help. Public testimony is on Wednesday in Columbus. Written testimony is also encouraged.

Please share this post as well.
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