HB 48: Remove some CPZs; modify affirmative defense

[Brian D.]

And let's not forgot those who carry large sums of cash as remuneration for less-than-wholesome commercial endeavors.

{Looking around nervously}: Hey, I was young and needed the money, man!

[WestonDon]

Speaking purely for myself, and not as the adviser for any campus concealed carry group that I may or may not be the faculty/staff adviser for, this wussified campuses can opt in and it would be legal business is a pile of horse {inappropriate language}. We all know the chances of anyone being given permission, that is if you are related to a member of the board of trustees. I hate these laws that create a second class of citizens. They just are too afraid to stand up to the Universities and I have no idea why that is.
Otherwise, I like the bill.

I agree. I also can sense your frustration. I believe this bill will attract some amendments anyhow so perhaps an amendment could be inserted to include universities in "certain government facilities"? What the heck, might as well include the rest of the schools while we are at it. Maybe something will stick.

[Klingon00]

This sounds like the right direction so far.

[Brian D.]

Only wish that this would go ahead at something faster than "The Senate will vote on the much amended version of it by mid-December of 2016 by the latest" speed.

[djthomas]

Looking into it more, this was definitely quickly drafted, probably just to get something out there. There's a lot of housekeeping needed, even to pass it "as is." For example in 2923.126 they left the definition of a government facility (G)(3) but since they nixed the only paragraph where it appeared they no longer need the definition. There's also no corresponding updates to the signage requirements, specifically day cares and government buildings would still be required to post, leading to potential criminal trespass issues.

In terms of amendments this bill is going to force the state's hand on an issue that has always bugged me. That is, state agencies dictating that private establishments post. If the bill passes as is I don't think we'll see a single day care remove their signs because the state will still include the "signs posted?" check in their inspection requirements. Likewise, BMVs will continue to be posted because the state works it into their contract. Not addressed by this bill, but casinos are similar. The state has adopted rules requiring casinos to post under the private property exception. Do I think casinos, the BMV, and most day cares would un-post? Probably not, but it's the principle of the matter. The state should not be displacing a private property owner's prerogative by virtue of the fact that they have a state license to operate, particularly when the legislature has already carefully decided what facilities are off limits.

If a place is statutorily off limits today, and the GA removes that restriction tomorrow I think one could make a good argument that some bureaucrat led agency sneaking that restriction back in through the side door is frustrating the policy decisions of the legislature.

[FormerNavy]

Looking into it more, this was definitely quickly drafted, probably just to get something out there. There's a lot of housekeeping needed, even to pass it "as is." For example in 2923.126 they left the definition of a government facility (G)(3) but since they nixed the only paragraph where it appeared they no longer need the definition. There's also no corresponding updates to the signage requirements, specifically day cares and government buildings would still be required to post, leading to potential criminal trespass issues.

In terms of amendments this bill is going to force the state's hand on an issue that has always bugged me. That is, state agencies dictating that private establishments post. If the bill passes as is I don't think we'll see a single day care remove their signs because the state will still include the "signs posted?" check in their inspection requirements. Likewise, BMVs will continue to be posted because the state works it into their contract. Not addressed by this bill, but casinos are similar. The state has adopted rules requiring casinos to post under the private property exception. Do I think casinos, the BMV, and most day cares would un-post? Probably not, but it's the principle of the matter. The state should not be displacing a private property owner's prerogative by virtue of the fact that they have a state license to operate, particularly when the legislature has already carefully decided what facilities are off limits.

If a place is statutorily off limits today, and the GA removes that restriction tomorrow I think one could make a good argument that some bureaucrat led agency sneaking that restriction back in through the side door is frustrating the policy decisions of the legislature.

None of this will matter for another 1.5 yrs. Seems to me that these bills often sit in the legislature until the session is nearly over then suddenly get some movement...

[Tweed Ring]

Why do you think this is the case in Ohio gun rights legislation?

[JediSkipdogg]

Why do you think this is the case in Ohio gun rights legislation?

$$$$$$$$$$$

[djthomas]

$$$$$$$$$$$

That and the way our Legislature works. Six months to hammer out the budget, then go on a break. Come back and hold hearings on things. Then go on a break. Then start the new year, hold some hearings and go on a break. Come back, break for 6 months to campaign. Come back after the elections and scramble to do everything that other states' legislatures do in 15 days.

[Tweed Ring]

Political optics and money. Politics wins elections. Money buys access to pols and their staff.

[Tweed Ring]

$$$$$$$$$$$

That and the way our Legislature works. Six months to hammer out the budget, then go on a break. Come back and hold hearings on things. Then go on a break. Then start the new year, hold some hearings and go on a break. Come back, break for 6 months to campaign. Come back after the elections and scramble to do everything that other states' legislatures do in 15 days.

Our OGA is a part-time legislature.

[JediSkipdogg]

$$$$$$$$$$$

That and the way our Legislature works. Six months to hammer out the budget, then go on a break. Come back and hold hearings on things. Then go on a break. Then start the new year, hold some hearings and go on a break. Come back, break for 6 months to campaign. Come back after the elections and scramble to do everything that other states' legislatures do in 15 days.

Our OGA is a part-time legislature.

And I'm not sure if their methods of work vacation work vacation is better than work for 60 days and vacation for 660 or not.

[curmudgeon3]

They don't want to pass any controversial issues during an election campaign season.
(The leader is out on an extended tour of the western states.)

[rickt]

They pass gun legislation in the lame duck session knowing that gives the low information voters two years to forget it ever happened. Since Ohio is 50/50 red/blue, the Repubs are always looking over their shoulders.

[rickt]

Yesterday a weaker version of HB 48 was substituted for the original. The substitute bill does not remove as many CPZs as the original.

BFA article: http://www.buckeyefirearms.org/house-co ... ctim-zones

Sub. HB 48: http://search-prod.lis.state.oh.us/cm_p ... ubhb48.pdf

If you go to the State Government Committee page and click the June 10 link, you can see all the opponent/proponent testimony from yesterday.