Message to Site Coordinators Moderators Patrons

A sub-forum for the purpose of discussing ORC 9.68 compliance. This sub-forum is strictly for the discussion of progress in individual cities and their respective parks.

Moderators: Coordinators, Moderators

Forum rules
This sub-forum is strictly for the purpose of submitting of, and status updates related to, ORC 9.68 compliance. This could mean park bans, open carry bans, or anything that is a compliance issue. Note the format in which original threads were created. We'll track each individual case here and post updates if assistance is needed, etc. You may start a new thread here to notify us of a non-compliant scenario. Please try to research contact information for each city, village, etc, Email, fax, and postal addresses are great. Digital photos of infractions (Signs) are ideal. With limited exceptions this is NOT a discussion forum.

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Re: Message to Site Coordinators Moderators Patrons

Postby fyrfytr310 » Wed Jul 16, 2014 1:19 pm

MyWifeSaidYes wrote:You are mistaken. :P

Municipalities cannot regulate firearms possession REGARDLESS of whether they have a CHL or not.

You are thinking of Ohio Revised Code 9.68, which went into effect in 2007. It was challenged twice in the Ohio Supreme Court, and survived both times.

The signage, as you describe it, IS in violation of 9.68.

The BEST move is to simply advise the city council about both the sign and R.C. 9.68 and ASK THEM TO PLEASE REMOVE OR AMEND THE SIGNS.

Email has worked best for me.


A recent success for example.
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Re: Message to Site Coordinators Moderators Patrons

Postby AmendII71 » Tue Aug 05, 2014 9:21 am

25 days since I sent the letter to the Village Law Director. No response and signs are still up. :(
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Re: Message to Site Coordinators Moderators Patrons

Postby MyWifeSaidYes » Tue Aug 05, 2014 11:23 am

AmendII71 wrote:25 days since I sent the letter to the Village Law Director. No response and signs are still up. :(


Can you post a copy of what you sent?

Also, PM me with their email address (and phone number, if you have it).
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Re: Message to Site Coordinators Moderators Patrons

Postby BriKuz » Tue Aug 05, 2014 1:42 pm

City Solicitor has a message waiting for him ;-)
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Re: Message to Site Coordinators Moderators Patrons

Postby MyWifeSaidYes » Tue Aug 05, 2014 3:01 pm

I just sent this to the Clerk of Council:

Please forward this to all council members.


Dear Council Members-

Please immediately start the process to amend city ordinances 965.01(f) and 965.02(f) to remove any restrictions on firearms in city parks.

The Supreme Court of Ohio has ruled that this is not allowed, as per R.C. 9.68. See "Ohioans for Concealed Carry, Inc. v. Clyde, 120 Ohio St.3d 96, 2008-Ohio-4605."

R.C. 9.68 also allows for awarding costs and attorney fees to any entity who chooses to sue the city and prevails. I have found no defense in your city charter or your codified ordinances that would not allow a plaintiff to prevail.


It has also come to my attention that the City Solicitor has been contacted about this same issue by another citizen nearly a month ago, but no return contact or follow-up was ever made. If this was an oversight, please open a dialog with me and I will apprise the other citizen of the city's current status on legislation to amend the illegal ordinances.

Or, is the City of Waverly purposely ignoring this issue?

Thanks!

-"MWSY"
Ohio's Friendliest Compliance Counselor
August 5, 2014 @ 4pm
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Re: Message to Site Coordinators Moderators Patrons

Postby AmendII71 » Wed Aug 06, 2014 9:59 am

MyWifeSaidYes wrote:
AmendII71 wrote:25 days since I sent the letter to the Village Law Director. No response and signs are still up. :(


Can you post a copy of what you sent?

Also, PM me with their email address (and phone number, if you have it).



I just sent you a PM. I will post the letter I sent on the forum, just give a minute to figure out how! :oops:
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Re: Message to Site Coordinators Moderators Patrons

Postby AmendII71 » Wed Aug 06, 2014 10:03 am

My letter said this:

Dear Mr. Seif,

Please accept this letter as a professional, polite and friendly attempt to distribute accurate, reliable and important information regarding the Village’s rules, regulations and ordinances as they pertain to The Ohio Revised Code, Section 9.68 and The 2nd Amendment of the United States Constitution. Please feel free to investigate the accuracy of the claims and/or opinions hereby issued as they relate to the experiences of other Ohio Municipal Governments.

At various locations within each of the Village’s public parks, signage has been posted that displays the various “Park Rules” for each of the parks in question. A picture of the sign placed at two (2) locations in Bristol Park, (Armbruster Parkway) has been inserted below as a visual reference.

On each of the signs posted, rule # 6 reads as follows:

“Firearms, fireworks or explosives of any kind are prohibited.”

Ohio Revised Code Section 9.68 mandates:
Except as specifically provided by the United States Constitution, Ohio Constitution, state law, or federal law, a person, without further license, permission, restriction, delay, or process, may * * * possess, [or] transport *** any firearm[.] (Emphasis added)
R.C. 9.68(A). That section also provides:
In addition to any other relief provided, the court shall award costs and reasonable attorney fees to any person, group, or entity that prevails in a challenge to an ordinance, rule, or regulation as being in conflict with this section.
R.C. 9.68(B).
The authority of R.C. 9.68 has already been recognized by the Ohio Supreme Court. In City of Cleveland v. State of Ohio, 128 Ohio St.3d 135, 2010-Ohio-6318, 942 N.E.2d 370, that Court clearly held:
R.C. 9.68 is a general law that displaces municipal firearm ordinances and does not unconstitutionally infringe on municipal home rule authority. (Emphasis added)
Id., at the syllabus. In rendering that decision, the Court reaffirmed its decision in Ohioans for Concealed Carry, Inc. v. City of Clyde, 120 Ohio St.3d 96, 2008-Ohio-4605, 896 N.E.2d 967, where the Court struck down a “no guns in the park” ordinance enacted by the City of Clyde, further stating that, by enacting R.C. 9.68, “[t]he General Assembly could not have been more direct in expressing its intent for statewide comprehensive handgun-possession laws.” Id., at 103, ¶41.


Given the above stated Ohio Case Law precedence, it is my sincere recommendation that such information be provided to the Village Council. I further recommend that all such signage posted at each Waverly Village Park be either revised and/or removed of such language that restricts firearms possession in the Village Parks. Finally, any and all such Village Codes, Ordinances and/or Rules currently in effect with the Village that are in conflict with Ohio Revised Code 9.68 should be rescinded.

Thank you for your cooperation and attention to this matter.

Sincerely



Nathan J. Davis
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Re: Message to Site Coordinators Moderators Patrons

Postby MyWifeSaidYes » Wed Aug 06, 2014 10:15 am

Ah, I see.

Too nice.

You gave recommendations instead of specifically asking for something to happen. (Please immediately remove these signs)

You didn't ask for them to contact you. (Also, please let me know when this will be done)

And you didn't re-phrase the "costs and attorney fees" into something more 'motivational'. (These signs expose the village to a lawsuit simply by being posted, which would be a waste of village taxpayer money)

:mrgreen:

JUST KIDDING!

Your letter was fine.

The real problem is that you sent it to a governmental body that probably just doesn't care.

It may require a visit to a village council meeting.
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Re: Message to Site Coordinators Moderators Patrons

Postby AmendII71 » Wed Aug 06, 2014 10:22 am

MyWifeSaidYes wrote:Ah, I see.

Too nice.

You gave recommendations instead of specifically asking for something to happen. (Please immediately remove these signs)

You didn't ask for them to contact you. (Also, please let me know when this will be done)

And you didn't re-phrase the "costs and attorney fees" into something more 'motivational'. (These signs expose the village to a lawsuit simply by being posted, which would be a waste of village taxpayer money)

:mrgreen:

JUST KIDDING!

Your letter was fine.

The real problem is that you sent it to a governmental body that probably just doesn't care.

It may require a visit to a village council meeting.


Good Points! How did you send the message to the Clerk of Council? Email, Letter...???
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Re: Message to Site Coordinators Moderators Patrons

Postby MyWifeSaidYes » Wed Aug 06, 2014 10:24 am

Email.
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Re: Message to Site Coordinators Moderators Patrons

Postby AmendII71 » Wed Aug 06, 2014 10:28 am

MyWifeSaidYes wrote:Email.



PM me your email address. I would like to discuss a follow up plan with you.
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Re: Message to Site Coordinators Moderators Patrons

Postby AmendII71 » Mon Aug 18, 2014 9:52 am

Received the following letter from the Village Solicitor Dale Seif on 8/14/14:

Dear Mr. Davis,
This is a confirmation that we received your correspondence dated July 9,2014 raising the issue
of constitutionality of Village's prohibition of the firearms, fireworks, or explosive in the public parks.
The matter was brought under Village Council's review. Once we finalize our research and have a
decision, then our office will contact you with an update.
Please feel free to contact my paralegal, Marius, or me if you have any questions or concerns.
Best regards,
(/~. £. "./.~ /
/
D. Dk-s{if, Jr.
DDS/mfi
CC: Mayor Kempton
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Re: Message to Site Coordinators Moderators Patrons

Postby MyWifeSaidYes » Mon Aug 18, 2014 1:27 pm

Is there a council meeting tomorrow night?

Some councils take a recess during the summer. If there IS a meeting on the schedule, you could always stop in and say hello.

:mrgreen:
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Re: Message to Site Coordinators Moderators Patrons

Postby Brian D. » Mon Aug 18, 2014 2:36 pm

AmendII71 wrote:Received the following letter from the Village Solicitor Dale Seif on 8/14/14:

Dear Mr. Davis,
This is a confirmation that we received your correspondence dated July 9,2014 raising the issue
of constitutionality of Village's prohibition of the firearms, fireworks, or explosive in the public parks.
The matter was brought under Village Council's review. Once we finalize our research and have a
decision...


How does such research take a mildly competent attorney or their paralegal more than about ten-fifteen minutes to accomplish? It. is. settled. case. law. that. has. been. vetted. all. the. way, through. Thee. Ohio. Supreme. Court.

Sometimes I muse that our main OFCC site needs a "Do Not Patronize This Lawyer If You Hope To Ever Win In Court' list.
Quit worrying, hide your gun well, shut up, and CARRY that handgun!

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Re: Message to Site Coordinators Moderators Patrons

Postby MyWifeSaidYes » Tue Aug 19, 2014 10:19 am

I have to work or I would definitely attend tonight's council meeting.

Here is Item #8 from the agenda:

8. New Business:

Resolution#41-2014(Emergency) - Purpose to authorize the Auditor to transfer $25,000.00 from the General Fund to the Fire Fund.

Resolution#42-2014(Emergency) - Purpose to authorize the Auditor to transfer $100,000.00 from the General Fund to the Police Fund.

Resolution#43-2014(Emergency) - Purpose to move appropriations, between lines within the individual funds in the Budget Appropriations.

Resolution#44-2014(1ST Reading) – Purpose is to establish a Waverly 220 Connector Earmark Fund for use in financing the shortfall of funds necessary to construct the Waverly Rt. 220 Connector over and above grant funds already committed to project.

Discussion - Carrying Concealed Firearms in Public Parks


At least they aren't afraid to pass things by emergency. :roll:
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