County Fair Issues: READ THIS and POST HERE ONLY!
Moderators: Chuck, Mustang380gal, Coordinators, Moderators
Forum rules
This sub-forum is strictly for the purpose of submitting of, and status updates related to, ORC 9.68 compliance. This could mean park bans, open carry bans, or anything that is a compliance issue. Note the format in which original threads were created. We'll track each individual case here and post updates if assistance is needed, etc. You may start a new thread here to notify us of a non-compliant scenario. Please try to research contact information for each city, village, etc, Email, fax, and postal addresses are great. Digital photos of infractions (Signs) are ideal. With limited exceptions this is NOT a discussion forum.
READ THIS BEFORE POSTING
This sub-forum is strictly for the purpose of submitting of, and status updates related to, ORC 9.68 compliance. This could mean park bans, open carry bans, or anything that is a compliance issue. Note the format in which original threads were created. We'll track each individual case here and post updates if assistance is needed, etc. You may start a new thread here to notify us of a non-compliant scenario. Please try to research contact information for each city, village, etc, Email, fax, and postal addresses are great. Digital photos of infractions (Signs) are ideal. With limited exceptions this is NOT a discussion forum.
READ THIS BEFORE POSTING
- BB62
- Posts: 2601
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- Location: Cincinnati, OH
Re: County Fair Issues: READ THIS and POST HERE ONLY!
Nice work JmE!
Now, on to the next challenge!
Now, on to the next challenge!
Yes, I do believe in open carry. An openly armed man is clear in his intentions. Concealed carriers are sneaks and skulkers and elitist, boot licking, political contribution making, running dog lackies of The Man. <wink> (thx grumpycoconut - OpenCarry.org)
Got Freedom?
Accountant, Computer & Management Consultant
Scuba Diver, NRA Life Member, NRA Instructor
Got Freedom?
Accountant, Computer & Management Consultant
Scuba Diver, NRA Life Member, NRA Instructor
-
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- Location: Dayton, Piqua, Ohio
Re: County Fair Issues: READ THIS and POST HERE ONLY!
I found this in the Miami County Ag Society's Rules.
29. It is illegal to carry a firearm,
deadly weapon, or dangerous ordnance
anywhere on these premises. No
person shall knowingly possess, have
under the person's control, convey, or
attempt to convey a deadly weapon or
dangerous ordnance onto these premises.
I have contacted them regarding ORC 9.68
29. It is illegal to carry a firearm,
deadly weapon, or dangerous ordnance
anywhere on these premises. No
person shall knowingly possess, have
under the person's control, convey, or
attempt to convey a deadly weapon or
dangerous ordnance onto these premises.
I have contacted them regarding ORC 9.68
No, I am not a policeman. I am a mercenary praying for peace on Earth.
I don't want a tactical advantage. I want the bad guys to repent and find a new line of work.
I don't want a tactical advantage. I want the bad guys to repent and find a new line of work.
- MyWifeSaidYes
- OFCC Coordinator
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Re: County Fair Issues: READ THIS and POST HERE ONLY!
Even when the fairs are over, keep after the Ag. Societies to take down invalid signage, and don't forget to check on them prior to next year's fair. Thet WILL try to sneak them back up.
MyWifeSaidYes
-
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Re: County Fair Issues: READ THIS and POST HERE ONLY!
This fair issue has been going on since 2009 and nothing (that would have a statewide impact) has been done to put a stop to it. Is anyone interested in pooling resources and filing a lawsuit? I will make a significant contribution and maybe we can get some help from one or more of the gun organizations. Please let me know if you're interested in doing some serious work on this issue.
Mike
OFCC Member
OFCC Member
- schmieg
- OFCC Coordinator
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Re: County Fair Issues: READ THIS and POST HERE ONLY!
There are several problems with doing that at this time based upon language in the ORC and in the lack of teeth in 9.68. This, unfortunately, is probably something we could better deal with legislatively.propertymanager wrote:This fair issue has been going on since 2009 and nothing (that would have a statewide impact) has been done to put a stop to it. Is anyone interested in pooling resources and filing a lawsuit? I will make a significant contribution and maybe we can get some help from one or more of the gun organizations. Please let me know if you're interested in doing some serious work on this issue.
-- Mike
"The smallest minority on earth is the individual. Those who deny individual rights cannot claim to be defenders of minorities." - Ayn Rand
"The smallest minority on earth is the individual. Those who deny individual rights cannot claim to be defenders of minorities." - Ayn Rand
-
- OFCC Patron Member
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Re: County Fair Issues: READ THIS and POST HERE ONLY!
What are the chances of giving teeth to 9.68 as a possible amendment to one of the current pro gun bills?schmieg wrote:There are several problems with doing that at this time based upon language in the ORC and in the lack of teeth in 9.68. This, unfortunately, is probably something we could better deal with legislatively.propertymanager wrote:This fair issue has been going on since 2009 and nothing (that would have a statewide impact) has been done to put a stop to it. Is anyone interested in pooling resources and filing a lawsuit? I will make a significant contribution and maybe we can get some help from one or more of the gun organizations. Please let me know if you're interested in doing some serious work on this issue.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOxXpNBdrVE" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
When seconds count, the police are only minutes away!
Life Member NRA
When seconds count, the police are only minutes away!
Life Member NRA
- schmieg
- OFCC Coordinator
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- Location: Madeira, Ohio
Re: County Fair Issues: READ THIS and POST HERE ONLY!
Stay tuned.pleasantguywhopacks wrote:What are the chances of giving teeth to 9.68 as a possible amendment to one of the current pro gun bills?schmieg wrote:There are several problems with doing that at this time based upon language in the ORC and in the lack of teeth in 9.68. This, unfortunately, is probably something we could better deal with legislatively.propertymanager wrote:This fair issue has been going on since 2009 and nothing (that would have a statewide impact) has been done to put a stop to it. Is anyone interested in pooling resources and filing a lawsuit? I will make a significant contribution and maybe we can get some help from one or more of the gun organizations. Please let me know if you're interested in doing some serious work on this issue.
-- Mike
"The smallest minority on earth is the individual. Those who deny individual rights cannot claim to be defenders of minorities." - Ayn Rand
"The smallest minority on earth is the individual. Those who deny individual rights cannot claim to be defenders of minorities." - Ayn Rand
- MyWifeSaidYes
- OFCC Coordinator
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Re: County Fair Issues: READ THIS and POST HERE ONLY!
Suing and winning against one Ag. Society may help prod the rest into compliance.
However, Cleveland still has bad gun laws on their books, even after Cleveland v. State.
ORC 9.68 allows for costs and reasonable attorney fees. Unless you find a judge willing to award punitive damages, that ain't much.
Yes, I am interested in creating, if not filing, a lawsuit against any Ag. Society that posts their fairgrounds.
Between ORC 1711.13 and the Ohio Supreme Court decision in Greene Cty. Agricultural Soc. v. Liming, 89 Ohio St.3d 551,
we know that these groups are subject to ORC 9.68.
Let's see if Ross County responds to the info people have been sending them. I may take my daughter to the fair today. It's only 40 miles away.
However, Cleveland still has bad gun laws on their books, even after Cleveland v. State.
ORC 9.68 allows for costs and reasonable attorney fees. Unless you find a judge willing to award punitive damages, that ain't much.
Yes, I am interested in creating, if not filing, a lawsuit against any Ag. Society that posts their fairgrounds.
Between ORC 1711.13 and the Ohio Supreme Court decision in Greene Cty. Agricultural Soc. v. Liming, 89 Ohio St.3d 551,
we know that these groups are subject to ORC 9.68.
Let's see if Ross County responds to the info people have been sending them. I may take my daughter to the fair today. It's only 40 miles away.
MyWifeSaidYes
- schmieg
- OFCC Coordinator
- Posts: 5751
- Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2005 11:11 pm
- Location: Madeira, Ohio
Re: County Fair Issues: READ THIS and POST HERE ONLY!
The problem goes beyond 9.68. If you look at 2923.1212(A)(9) which directs who shall post signs, you will see where it says:MyWifeSaidYes wrote:Suing and winning against one Ag. Society may help prod the rest into compliance.
However, Cleveland still has bad gun laws on their books, even after Cleveland v. State.
ORC 9.68 allows for costs and reasonable attorney fees. Unless you find a judge willing to award punitive damages, that ain't much.
Yes, I am interested in creating, if not filing, a lawsuit against any Ag. Society that posts their fairgrounds.
Between ORC 1711.13 and the Ohio Supreme Court decision in Greene Cty. Agricultural Soc. v. Liming, 89 Ohio St.3d 551,
we know that these groups are subject to ORC 9.68.
Let's see if Ross County responds to the info people have been sending them. I may take my daughter to the fair today. It's only 40 miles away.
This indicates that we need to revise more than just 9.68.The officer of this state or of a political subdivision of this state, or the officer’s designee, who has charge of a building that is a government facility of this state or the political subdivision of this state, as defined in section 2923.126 of the Revised Code, and that is not a building that is used primarily as a shelter, restroom, parking facility for motor vehicles, or rest facility, or on property used, leased or owned by an agricultural society as defined in section 1711.01 and 1711.02 of the Revised Code, and is not a courthouse or other building or structure in which a courtroom is located that is subject to division (B)(3) of that section.
-- Mike
"The smallest minority on earth is the individual. Those who deny individual rights cannot claim to be defenders of minorities." - Ayn Rand
"The smallest minority on earth is the individual. Those who deny individual rights cannot claim to be defenders of minorities." - Ayn Rand
-
- Posts: 709
- Joined: Thu May 07, 2009 8:09 pm
- Location: Central Ohio
Re: County Fair Issues: READ THIS and POST HERE ONLY!
I looked up 2923.1212(A)(9) on lawwriter and it says:
(9) The officer of this state or of a political subdivision of this state, or the officer's designee, who has charge of a building that is a government facility of this state or the political subdivision of this state, as defined in section 2923.126 of the Revised Code, and that is not a building that is used primarily as a shelter, restroom, parking facility for motor vehicles, or rest facility and is not a courthouse or other building or structure in which a courtroom is located that is subject to division (B)(3) of that section.
It doesn't say anything about agricultural societies. What's the difference between this version and yours?
(9) The officer of this state or of a political subdivision of this state, or the officer's designee, who has charge of a building that is a government facility of this state or the political subdivision of this state, as defined in section 2923.126 of the Revised Code, and that is not a building that is used primarily as a shelter, restroom, parking facility for motor vehicles, or rest facility and is not a courthouse or other building or structure in which a courtroom is located that is subject to division (B)(3) of that section.
It doesn't say anything about agricultural societies. What's the difference between this version and yours?
Mike
OFCC Member
OFCC Member
- schmieg
- OFCC Coordinator
- Posts: 5751
- Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2005 11:11 pm
- Location: Madeira, Ohio
Re: County Fair Issues: READ THIS and POST HERE ONLY!
The difference is I was using a copy on my system that was changed in 2008 which I had failed to update. (I retired in 2007, so I probably missed that one). I just checked it against CaseMaker and your version is correct. Good call. Ok, we're back to 9.68 needing to be changed. Hold your breath for the legislature to come back and see what happens.propertymanager wrote:I looked up 2923.1212(A)(9) on lawwriter and it says:
(9) The officer of this state or of a political subdivision of this state, or the officer's designee, who has charge of a building that is a government facility of this state or the political subdivision of this state, as defined in section 2923.126 of the Revised Code, and that is not a building that is used primarily as a shelter, restroom, parking facility for motor vehicles, or rest facility and is not a courthouse or other building or structure in which a courtroom is located that is subject to division (B)(3) of that section.
It doesn't say anything about agricultural societies. What's the difference between this version and yours?
-- Mike
"The smallest minority on earth is the individual. Those who deny individual rights cannot claim to be defenders of minorities." - Ayn Rand
"The smallest minority on earth is the individual. Those who deny individual rights cannot claim to be defenders of minorities." - Ayn Rand
- Werz
- OFCC Patron Member
- Posts: 5506
- Joined: Sun Aug 16, 2009 2:37 am
Re: County Fair Issues: READ THIS and POST HERE ONLY!
I'm still trying to figure out where you got the version you quoted. As nearly as I can tell, R.C. 2923.126(A)(9) went from "Any building that is owned by this state or any political subdivision of this state" to the current version with 127 SB 184, effective 09/09/2008, and hasn't changed since then. When was there ever a "fairgrounds exception"?schmieg wrote:The difference is I was using a copy on my system that was changed in 2008 which I had failed to update. (I retired in 2007, so I probably missed that one). I just checked it against CaseMaker and your version is correct. Good call. Ok, we're back to 9.68 needing to be changed. Hold your breath for the legislature to come back and see what happens.propertymanager wrote:I looked up 2923.1212(A)(9) on lawwriter and it says:
(9) The officer of this state or of a political subdivision of this state, or the officer's designee, who has charge of a building that is a government facility of this state or the political subdivision of this state, as defined in section 2923.126 of the Revised Code, and that is not a building that is used primarily as a shelter, restroom, parking facility for motor vehicles, or rest facility and is not a courthouse or other building or structure in which a courtroom is located that is subject to division (B)(3) of that section.
It doesn't say anything about agricultural societies. What's the difference between this version and yours?
"An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life."
-- Robert A. Heinlein, Beyond This Horizon
"Remember that protecting our gun rights still boils down to keeping a majority in the electorate, and that our daily activities can have the impact of being ambassadors for the gun culture ..."
-- BobK
Open carry is a First Amendment exercise.
-- Robert A. Heinlein, Beyond This Horizon
"Remember that protecting our gun rights still boils down to keeping a majority in the electorate, and that our daily activities can have the impact of being ambassadors for the gun culture ..."
-- BobK
Open carry is a First Amendment exercise.
- schmieg
- OFCC Coordinator
- Posts: 5751
- Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2005 11:11 pm
- Location: Madeira, Ohio
Re: County Fair Issues: READ THIS and POST HERE ONLY!
Any more, I'm not sure. I downloaded a bunch of stuff as the laws were passed to have them on my system. I thought I was keeping it all up to date, but, now, I'm not sure, so I' going back to using CaseMaker, though it takes more time.Werz wrote:I'm still trying to figure out where you got the version you quoted. As nearly as I can tell, R.C. 2923.126(A)(9) went from "Any building that is owned by this state or any political subdivision of this state" to the current version with 127 SB 184, effective 09/09/2008, and hasn't changed since then. When was there ever a "fairgrounds exception"?schmieg wrote:The difference is I was using a copy on my system that was changed in 2008 which I had failed to update. (I retired in 2007, so I probably missed that one). I just checked it against CaseMaker and your version is correct. Good call. Ok, we're back to 9.68 needing to be changed. Hold your breath for the legislature to come back and see what happens.propertymanager wrote:I looked up 2923.1212(A)(9) on lawwriter and it says:
(9) The officer of this state or of a political subdivision of this state, or the officer's designee, who has charge of a building that is a government facility of this state or the political subdivision of this state, as defined in section 2923.126 of the Revised Code, and that is not a building that is used primarily as a shelter, restroom, parking facility for motor vehicles, or rest facility and is not a courthouse or other building or structure in which a courtroom is located that is subject to division (B)(3) of that section.
It doesn't say anything about agricultural societies. What's the difference between this version and yours?
Since retiring, I have found I miss a lot of the software I had on my systems while practicing, but I can't justify the expense to keep it updated since I'm not making any money off it. I did for a while, but that got pretty old pretty fast. I really missed Perfect Probate while doing my mother-in-law's estate last year.
-- Mike
"The smallest minority on earth is the individual. Those who deny individual rights cannot claim to be defenders of minorities." - Ayn Rand
"The smallest minority on earth is the individual. Those who deny individual rights cannot claim to be defenders of minorities." - Ayn Rand
- MyWifeSaidYes
- OFCC Coordinator
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Re: County Fair Issues: READ THIS and POST HERE ONLY!
Are these options better for the ORC than just searching at http://codes.ohio.gov" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;?
MyWifeSaidYes
- Werz
- OFCC Patron Member
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Re: County Fair Issues: READ THIS and POST HERE ONLY!
Some attorneys use that, but Casemaker has Revised Code, case law, AG opinions, court rules, jury instructions, etc., and it's all cross-referenced by hyperlinks. Also, in situations like this one, it has Revised Code archives with former versions of the statutes. It also provides access to statutes and case law from other states, plus federal materials.MyWifeSaidYes wrote:Are these options better for the ORC than just searching at http://codes.ohio.gov" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;?
However, you need an Ohio State Bar Association membership.
"An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life."
-- Robert A. Heinlein, Beyond This Horizon
"Remember that protecting our gun rights still boils down to keeping a majority in the electorate, and that our daily activities can have the impact of being ambassadors for the gun culture ..."
-- BobK
Open carry is a First Amendment exercise.
-- Robert A. Heinlein, Beyond This Horizon
"Remember that protecting our gun rights still boils down to keeping a majority in the electorate, and that our daily activities can have the impact of being ambassadors for the gun culture ..."
-- BobK
Open carry is a First Amendment exercise.