Head Scratcher?

To learn and introduce new loaders. Tips and tricks from old timers.

Moderators: Chuck, Mustang380gal, Coordinators, Moderators

Post Reply
User avatar
SAILORMAN
Posts: 72
Joined: Wed May 15, 2013 11:20 am
Location: Columbus, Oh

Head Scratcher?

Post by SAILORMAN »

Well I thought I had seen just about every kind of mutilated, cracked, split, and separated brass out there but these have me scratching my head? When separating brass from our last range trip (indoor range) I found 4 of these they had all been fired, brass was dirty primer has been hit. They are 9mm cases 3 different head stamps so I presume they have been reloaded. But the top half of the shell has been expanded to the same size as a fired 40s&w brass they even mic the same at the mouth. I didn't find them till after they went thru the tumbler for about an hour ready for decapping so they have been partially cleaned.

See pics:
http://tinypic.com/r/2kiuts/8" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://tinypic.com/r/w98ltk/8" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://tinypic.com/r/2ex6n9g/8" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

How in the world could you do that?
User avatar
Morne
OFCC Coordinator
OFCC Coordinator
Posts: 10631
Joined: Thu Jul 07, 2005 9:01 pm
Location: Wayne County

Re: Head Scratcher?

Post by Morne »

Idiots putting 9mm rounds in .40 guns.
Thus spoke Zarathustra.

Footsoldier in the Conservative Insurrection of the GOP.

Remember, only you can prevent big government!
User avatar
SAILORMAN
Posts: 72
Joined: Wed May 15, 2013 11:20 am
Location: Columbus, Oh

Re: Head Scratcher?

Post by SAILORMAN »

We thought about that but with the brass being shorter not sure it would set off the primer. Also wouldn't there be a lot more brass deformation or splitting.

What ever they did they did it at least 4 times.
SMMAssociates
Posts: 9557
Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2005 1:36 am
Location: Youngstown OH

Re: Head Scratcher?

Post by SMMAssociates »

SAILORMAN:

Morne's probably right....

In many situations, the extractor will capture the shorter case, and hold it well enough to let the firing pin ignite the primer. The 9mm is just close enough to fit, line up, etc., otherwise.

If you've got an M&P9, it's magazines will fit an M&P40, and should feed properly, although ejection might fail.

Not a good idea, but the .40's got to be solid enough to deal with a 9mm that way.

(If you have an M&P9, either full size or compact, the slide & barrel will interchange with a same-sized M&P40.)

I expect that the Glocks will do that, too....

I won't admit it, but somebody with my initials once put a full magazine of .380's into an old S&W M39-2 (9mm semi). First round fired. Ejection failed.

Regards,
Stu.

(Why write a quick note when you can write a novel?)

(Why do those who claim to wish to protect me feel that the best way to do that is to disarm me?)

יזכר לא עד פעם
User avatar
Sevens
OFCC Patron Member
OFCC Patron Member
Posts: 7526
Joined: Thu May 07, 2009 8:30 am
Location: Far East Side of CBus

Re: Head Scratcher?

Post by Sevens »

Yeah, that's exactly what it is. Extractor holds it and when the round goes off, it never reaches anywhere near it's pressure potential.

It's careless and paints a bigger picture of the type of people who end up doing it, but it's simply not really all that dangerous... specifically in the case of 9mm in .40cal guns.

If you collect enough brass, you'll see them in a myriad of head stamps. I have a .357 Sig piece that must have been shot from a .40cal pistol as it's completely ironed out, hard to tell it's not a piece of .40 brass until you read the head stamp.
I like to swap brass... and I'm looking for .32 H&R Mag, .327 Fed Mag, .380 Auto and 10mm. If you have some and would like to swap for something else, send me a note!
mreising
Posts: 6274
Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2005 8:07 pm
Location: Warren County

Re: Head Scratcher?

Post by mreising »

We had an instructor candidate do that with a 40 in a 45 with the same results about 8 years ago. He didn't pass on the first try.
The tyrant will always find a pretext for his tyranny

Mark
NRA Training Counselor-Rifle, Pistol, Shotgun, Reloading, Personal Protection in the Home, Personal Protection Outside the Home, Home Firearms Safety, Chief RSO. NRA Endowment Life member.
User avatar
sodbuster95
OFCC Patron Member
OFCC Patron Member
Posts: 6954
Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2008 5:14 pm
Location: Maumee
Contact:

Re: Head Scratcher?

Post by sodbuster95 »

Morne wrote:Idiots putting 9mm rounds in .40 guns.
Eh, err, um...I've done that. :oops: Twice, actually. :oops: :oops:

In both cases, the round did not discharge. It did however, leave me in quite a state of brief confusion to watch the entire round, brass and all, come out the end of the barrel.

Here's a video of a guy that says he shot 9mm through a .40. Fast forward to 3:20; the case looks a heckuva lot like the images above.
NRA Benefactor Life Member

Information posted in these forums is my personal opinion only. It is not intended, nor should it be construed, as legal advice.
User avatar
SAILORMAN
Posts: 72
Joined: Wed May 15, 2013 11:20 am
Location: Columbus, Oh

Re: Head Scratcher?

Post by SAILORMAN »

Thanks for all the responses guys kinda what we thought just didn't know about the extractor grabbing the brass enough for it to be set off.

Another one to go in the crazy brass box! LOL

That had to be a really weird sounding round you would have thought they would have noticed before 4 rounds were fired.

And kind of surprised it cycled the action enough for them to fire those 4 rounds.
User avatar
Sevens
OFCC Patron Member
OFCC Patron Member
Posts: 7526
Joined: Thu May 07, 2009 8:30 am
Location: Far East Side of CBus

Re: Head Scratcher?

Post by Sevens »

It could be that they did it on purpose, too. Most likely, if I had to guess, was that they had similar handguns out and in use, and someone most likely stuffed the wrong mag in to one of the guns. And if it was a newer shooter along for the day, it may have been that person that didn't notice right away what was going on.

.40 S&W was designed specifically to be very close in dimensions to the 9mm and handloaders know that they use the same shell holder/shell plate. The rim is a wee-bit bigger on the .40cal, but the extractor groove is basically the SAME. Fitting 9mm rounds in to the breech face of a .40cal pistol is easy... and natural.

The .40 S&W was born in 1990 as an alternative to lightly loaded 10mm ammo. That's why we even have .40 S&W in the first place. S&W made huge 3rd Gen 10mm pistols and someone campaigned for the 180 grain bullet to be dropped from 1,200 FPS to 950 FPS. (I say "someone" because it's a point of contentious argument, it seems...) When Winchester, at S&W's request started making lighter 10mm at that speed, Smith & Wesson said "you know... we can do this with a smaller cartridge... and fit them in to 9mm-sized handguns..."

Glock then shanghai'd Smith & Wesson by releasing a .40cal pistol before Smith & Wesson could get a .40 Smith & Wesson pistol to the market. Evil! :twisted:
I like to swap brass... and I'm looking for .32 H&R Mag, .327 Fed Mag, .380 Auto and 10mm. If you have some and would like to swap for something else, send me a note!
User avatar
dan dan the XD40 man
Posts: 8370
Joined: Mon Dec 26, 2005 9:49 am
Location: Cleveland Ohio
Contact:

Re: Head Scratcher?

Post by dan dan the XD40 man »

Sevens wrote:
Glock then shanghai'd Smith & Wesson by releasing a .40cal pistol before Smith & Wesson could get a .40 Smith & Wesson pistol to the market. Evil! :twisted:

One of my favorite stories :mrgreen:
Poop!
User avatar
BobK
Posts: 15602
Joined: Sun Jan 14, 2007 10:26 pm
Location: Houston TX (formerly Franklin County)

Re: Head Scratcher?

Post by BobK »

dan dan the XD40 man wrote:
Sevens wrote:Glock then shanghai'd Smith & Wesson by releasing a .40cal pistol before Smith & Wesson could get a .40 Smith & Wesson pistol to the market. Evil! :twisted:
One of my favorite stories :mrgreen:
Unless my memory fails me, I believe Ruger beat S&W to market with a .44 Magnum back in the mid-50's with a similar story.
I am a: NRA Life Member, Texas State Rifle Association Life Member, Texas Firearms Coalition Gold member, OFCC Patron Member, former JFPO member (pre-SAF).

This froggie ain't boiling! Shall not be infringed! Μολών Λαβέ
More Obamination. Idiots. Can't we find an electable (R) for 2016?
BigV
Posts: 1555
Joined: Mon Jan 09, 2006 9:29 pm
Location: Akron, OH

Re: Head Scratcher?

Post by BigV »

Here's a .40 I shot out of my .45.
My son loaded my magazine(s)...


Image
BigV
MikeACP
Posts: 1892
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2007 4:16 pm
Location: Columbus

Re: Head Scratcher?

Post by MikeACP »

I found a couple of cases exactly like those last summer. I meant to ask someone about it, but got busy and forgot.
ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
glocksmith
Posts: 3918
Joined: Fri Apr 22, 2011 10:04 am
Location: Cincinnati/SW Ohio

Re: Head Scratcher?

Post by glocksmith »

BigV wrote:My son loaded my magazine(s)
Sure he did. It's always someone elses fault :lol:
Give em' Hell Pike!!!
dakina76
Posts: 4
Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2014 1:20 pm

Re: Head Scratcher?

Post by dakina76 »

I was sorting brass yesterday and came across the very same thing! I had the same thought as to what had happened. Found about four so far...
Post Reply