Ohio University Open Carry Walk - misleading commentary

Open Carry is carrying a firearm unconcealed in Ohio. OC does not require a concealed handgun license, but the practice requires intimate knowledge of the law since there are places and situations where OC is prohibited but carrying concealed would be permitted. OC is also likely to attract attention. This forum is for discussion of OC, not for debating the pro's and con's or coordinating any type of protest events.

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A letter to the editor from another OU Walk participant

Postby BB62 » Sat Apr 22, 2017 12:30 pm

(the editor's name is Terry Smith, btw)

"Dear Mr. Smith,

On this night, I felt compelled to respond to your impassioned commentary on the Ohio Open Carry Walk that took place on Easter weekend. As a part of the walk, I feel I can share some perspective missing from the article titled "What open-carry walkers hoped to prove remains a mystery". It is a shame you did not have the time to come talk to us, but I hope to open up some of that dialogue now.

To start with, you seem to be under the assumption that the goal (or result despite the goal) is to intimidate bystanders, but nothing could be further from the truth. In fact, your description of the crowd reaction of "indifferent" would be excellent for us. An informed populace that does not have a reactionary response to guns is what we strive for. However, this is not an ideal world, and many people still have uninformed and even bigoted opinions of people who carry firearms (PWCFs).

A perfect example of this is the "International Faculty member" quoted in your article. It almost sounds like they are directly advocating for the suspension of education because some people may have a negative reaction. Well that is a very misinformed opinion. Our country is founded both on the free marketplace of ideas, and the right to bear arms (among other freedoms we enjoy). The point of the walk is to get people talked, when they otherwise wouldn't. I've been to several of Jeffry's walks and can personally attest to their effectiveness. We have been thanked, we have swayed opinions, and occasionally we have been reviled by people who refuse to understand. Each and every reaction is valuable in order to get people talking, and to educate the public. I personally spoke with several students and staff, who both agreed and disagreed, but each encounter was valuable and I feel I was able to convey to them exactly what we are about.

So, when you say what we hoped to prove, "remains a mystery" I hope now You can confidently say "these people want to provoke a response so a conversation can be had, and people can be educated on their point of view". The vast majority of negative responses to our walk are from people ignorant of firearms and self protection philosophy. There is so much to know about our cause that cannot be learned by disparaging it from the sidelines. I hope to see you, Terry Smith, at the walk should Jeffery decide to organize another one next year.

Sincerely, with high hopes for the future,
Carlos Sanchez"

P.S. - Carlos is a current student at Kent State University, and participated in the OU Walk while wearing a single sidearm.

At Kent State, the administration announced the Walk to KSU students only the day before it, despite having received weeks worth of advance notice and other communications from me.
Yes, I do believe in open carry. An openly armed man is clear in his intentions. Concealed carriers are sneaks and skulkers and elitist, boot licking, political contribution making, running dog lackies of The Man. <wink> (thx grumpycoconut - OpenCarry.org)

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Re: Ohio University Open Carry Walk - misleading commentary

Postby Mustang380gal » Sun Apr 23, 2017 11:36 am

Instead of relying on universities, who really don't want you there, to publicize that you will be there, how about you or a student on campus print your own flyers, and post them on bulletin boards on campus. Promote your own event.

However, you may really want to pay attention to the climate on campus nowadays. The students in many big schools are having the curiosity educated right out of them. They are not willing to hear opposing points of view, and they are not going to seek out opposing views. Google the riots and unrest from having Milo, Ann Coulter and other conservatives come to campuses across the country to speak.

They don't talk to you because they don't want to hear what you have to say. Your message is falling on intentionally deaf ears.

Last point. Subtle personal attacks against one of the most ardent supporters of OC that I have ever met really does not help your cause. It merely makes many of the rest of us not want to hear anything you say, either.
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Re: Ohio University Open Carry Walk - misleading commentary

Postby BB62 » Sun Apr 23, 2017 8:12 pm

Mustang380gal wrote:Instead of relying on universities, who really don't want you there, to publicize that you will be there, how about you or a student on campus print your own flyers, and post them on bulletin boards on campus. Promote your own event.

However, you may really want to pay attention to the climate on campus nowadays. The students in many big schools are having the curiosity educated right out of them. They are not willing to hear opposing points of view, and they are not going to seek out opposing views. Google the riots and unrest from having Milo, Ann Coulter and other conservatives come to campuses across the country to speak.

They don't talk to you because they don't want to hear what you have to say. Your message is falling on intentionally deaf ears.

Last point. Subtle personal attacks against one of the most ardent supporters of OC that I have ever met really does not help your cause. It merely makes many of the rest of us not want to hear anything you say, either.

<rolls eyes>
Yes, I do believe in open carry. An openly armed man is clear in his intentions. Concealed carriers are sneaks and skulkers and elitist, boot licking, political contribution making, running dog lackies of The Man. <wink> (thx grumpycoconut - OpenCarry.org)

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Re: Ohio University Open Carry Walk - misleading commentary

Postby JediSkipdogg » Sun Apr 23, 2017 8:18 pm

BB62 wrote:
Mustang380gal wrote:Instead of relying on universities, who really don't want you there, to publicize that you will be there, how about you or a student on campus print your own flyers, and post them on bulletin boards on campus. Promote your own event.

However, you may really want to pay attention to the climate on campus nowadays. The students in many big schools are having the curiosity educated right out of them. They are not willing to hear opposing points of view, and they are not going to seek out opposing views. Google the riots and unrest from having Milo, Ann Coulter and other conservatives come to campuses across the country to speak.

They don't talk to you because they don't want to hear what you have to say. Your message is falling on intentionally deaf ears.

Last point. Subtle personal attacks against one of the most ardent supporters of OC that I have ever met really does not help your cause. It merely makes many of the rest of us not want to hear anything you say, either.

<rolls eyes>


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Re: Ohio University Open Carry Walk - misleading commentary

Postby glocksmith » Mon Apr 24, 2017 5:54 am

It's a wonder he still does...given the way you guys treat him. As I see it, all he did was post the story. It was someone else who started the "personal attack" business...though I'll not mention his name.
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Re: Ohio University Open Carry Walk - misleading commentary

Postby Chuck » Mon Apr 24, 2017 6:46 am

I apologize
My remark wasn't intended as an attack, but rather my opinion on what went wrong


I have supported BB's activism on campus carry and encouraged him to advertise his walks on our forums
But facts are facts and this one was a dude.
My suggestion on how to improve getting the message out is a valid one, in my opinion
Old Glory flying and a single piece of poster board with the words "Support Concealed Carry on Campus" would go a long way towards avoiding folks saying "I don't know what they're trying to accomplish"

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Re: Ohio University Open Carry Walk - misleading commentary

Postby glocksmith » Mon Apr 24, 2017 7:01 am

Chuck I sort of agree with you that it wasn't a "personal attack"...and I'm a bit puzzled...actually not :roll: ...that someone labeled BB62's response as a "personal attack" and deleted it while leaving yours up. Let's be fair to all persons participating on the forum - if someone's gonna fire arrows at someone, then that person should be able to fire back...as opposed to having one of the referees play favorites with the mod button.

EDIT - IBTL IBTL
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Re: Ohio University Open Carry Walk - misleading commentary

Postby Mustang380gal » Mon Apr 24, 2017 8:06 am

First of all, according to the TOS, actions of the moderators are not to be discussed in the open forums. In the event you have not read them lately, you may find them HERE. If you have a problem with me or any other moderator, PM me, and I will be happy to give an answer, or find out why if it was not me. And I did give a reason in the forum, which I am not required to do.

Chuck did not attack him; he pointed out that communication skills are lacking. That point is true, and it is not an attack. It's about along the lines of saying that Carmen spells words wrong. It's true, and not an attack. If someone questioned his intelligence about it, that would be an attack (My apologies, Carmen. It was the best analogy I could come up with now.)

If the editor was left without understanding the point of the walk, it rather validates what Chuck said. Chuck did not violate anything in the TOS with what he said. There was no reason to delete his post. If Chuck would have attacked BB62, I would have removed his post, too. I believe I have modded Chuck in the past. If I remember correctly, I removed a whole string of posts that turned into nasty arguments that Chuck was involved in. I am an equal-opportunity moderator.


BB62 made a personal attack. That violates the TOS, and the attack was removed.
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Re: Ohio University Open Carry Walk - misleading commentary

Postby glocksmith » Mon Apr 24, 2017 8:19 am

Yes, I am well aware about the TOS and not being able to criticize the actions of moderators. That said, I don't think the bulk of OFCC forumites are ignorant enough to not know what's up here...patterns do develop. When I posted my above comments I knew in advance that such a response from you would be coming. TBH, I can't exactly remember what BB62 said in response to Chuck...and it's kinda hard to discuss it now that those words have long vanished to join many other deleted comments and killed threads. Let's face it...Chuck's comments "drew first blood" and inspired whatever followed from BB62. I don't consider Chuck's comments to have been personal - although they certainly weren't flattering. Personal would be insulting someone's kids or their fat wife by way of the forum. IIRC BB62 didn't do that. All I'm saying is that people's hands are tied by rules in the TOS and that should apply equally. If two parties have a squabble - which crosses the lines - then the offending posts of both parties should be deleted from the thread.
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Re: Ohio University Open Carry Walk - misleading commentary

Postby Mustang380gal » Mon Apr 24, 2017 8:41 am

BB62 attacked Chuck's character. I do remember what he said. Chuck did not draw first blood. He disagreed with BB62's tactics. Nothing wrong with that.


You are fairly new here. When the forum first opened, and for a few years thereafter, the fights were unbelievable. The no personal attack rule came from that era when attacks that were as nasty as I have ever heard were common, and for minor slights. If people cannot remain civil over minor slights, then maybe the internet is not the place for them. Thick versus thin skin.....

Are you trying to get the thread locked? I told you to take it to PM, and I PM'd you.

If there is further discussion about the walk, keep posting. But the rabbit trail of moderator action is done.
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Re: Ohio University Open Carry Walk - misleading commentary

Postby glocksmith » Mon Apr 24, 2017 8:48 am

No...I'm finished and have nothing else to say. I'm glad we didn't do all this via PM...this will let everyone else reading this learn from it and arrive at their own conclusions.
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Re: Ohio University Open Carry Walk - misleading commentary

Postby Brian D. » Mon Apr 24, 2017 1:30 pm

I will just remind everyone that OC walks helped us to get concealed carry legalized in the first place here in Ohio. To me it's still a good tactic politically.
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Re: Ohio University Open Carry Walk - misleading commentary

Postby westsidebestside » Mon Apr 24, 2017 1:42 pm

Brian D. wrote:I will just remind everyone that OC walks helped us to get concealed carry legalized in the first place here in Ohio. To me it's still a good tactic politically.


Perhaps, but only if executed correctly. It couldn't be more obvious that the one in question was 100% ineptly managed from start to finish.
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Re: Ohio University Open Carry Walk - misleading commentary

Postby Mustang380gal » Mon Apr 24, 2017 1:53 pm

Brian D. wrote:I will just remind everyone that OC walks helped us to get concealed carry legalized in the first place here in Ohio. To me it's still a good tactic politically.


I am not disparaging OC walks at all. I understand how they have helped us in the past.

The climate on campuses may be changing, however, which may lessen potential impact there. In order to keep it relevant and positively influence people, there may need to be some change in how it is done. Maybe a speaker with an outdoor sound system. How about setting up a booth with free cookies/coffee during finals week so that students have a reason to approach activists?

Things change. We need to be willing to adapt. Creativity can help advance the cause.
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Re: Ohio University Open Carry Walk - misleading commentary

Postby MyWifeSaidYes » Mon Apr 24, 2017 7:25 pm

Am I missing something?

What harm did the walk do?

I didn't think that getting anti-gunners to whine and complain was a bad thing.

:?
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