OC Video

Open Carry is carrying a firearm unconcealed in Ohio. OC does not require a concealed handgun license, but the practice requires intimate knowledge of the law since there are places and situations where OC is prohibited but carrying concealed would be permitted. OC is also likely to attract attention. This forum is for discussion of OC, not for debating the pro's and con's or coordinating any type of protest events.

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sabalo
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OC Video

Post by sabalo »

Michael Bane's DownRange video on the rights and responsibilities of open carrying.
Worth a view, agree or not, with his point of view.

http://www.downrange.tv/blog/open-carry ... nse/18059/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: OC Video

Post by Tweed Ring »

Thank you. I just sent this to one of my kids, who most recently asked me a boatload of questions about open carry in Ohio.
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Re: OC Video

Post by D_Weezy »

I don't agree with this video. The first scene makes open carriers look like nut jobs. In the second and third scenes the police violate the gun carriers fourth Amendment Rights. The police had no RAS to arrest the gun carrier. What happened to Terry v Ohio, UNITED STATES v. DeBERRY and Hiibel v. Sixth Judicial District Court of Nevada. They are saying in this video, if you are carrying a weapon you should not assert your Rights. They want you to comply with unlawful orders by the police. I watched a video a while ago with whom I believe to be the guy on the right, doing a full blown anti-open carry statement. Here below is some reading for you.

http://www.policechiefmagazine.org/maga ... _id=122005" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://caselaw.findlaw.com/us-7th-circuit/1027378.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Werz
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Re: OC Video

Post by Werz »

D_Weezy wrote:* * * What happened to Terry v Ohio, UNITED STATES v. DeBERRY and Hiibel v. Sixth Judicial District Court of Nevada.
http://caselaw.findlaw.com/us-7th-circuit/1027378.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Why do people keep citing DeBerry? The holding of that case is not beneficial to open carry, and the only beneficial thing in that case is a "what if" scenario in dicta in a single judge's concurring opinion in a Seventh Circuit case. It might as well have been something you heard on talk radio.
Last edited by Werz on Fri Oct 19, 2012 11:06 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: OC Video

Post by Tweed Ring »

To me, the video showed a worst case scenario and, finally, a best case scenario.
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Re: OC Video

Post by Werz »

Tweed Ring wrote:To me, the video showed a worst case scenario and, finally, a best case scenario.
It also shows, particularly in the second scenario, the risks that one accepts by asserting the full extent of constitutional liberties. You can rant and rave all day on the internet, but none of that will change what happens curbside.
"An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life."
-- Robert A. Heinlein, Beyond This Horizon
"Remember that protecting our gun rights still boils down to keeping a majority in the electorate, and that our daily activities can have the impact of being ambassadors for the gun culture ..."
-- BobK
Open carry is a First Amendment exercise.
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Re: OC Video

Post by D_Weezy »

Werz wrote:
D_Weezy wrote:* * * What happened to Terry v Ohio, UNITED STATES v. DeBERRY and Hiibel v. Sixth Judicial District Court of Nevada.
http://caselaw.findlaw.com/us-7th-circuit/1027378.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Why do people keep citing DeBerry? The holding of that case is not beneficial to open carry, and the only beneficial thing in that case is a "what if" scenario in dicta in a single judge's concurring opinion in a Seventh Circuit case. It might as well have been something you heard on talk radio.[/quote

Dicta is personal opinion and holds no legal weight itself. It is dicta, but don't you think Judges read and then agree with other Judges opinions and then come to some of the same legal conclusions according to these opinions? It might not be right but I am sure that it happens. The original anonymous call in DeBerry was a man with a gun in his waistband. That could be anyone open carrying in a State that supports open carry. The original anonymous call is why I cited this case. The problem in the DeBerry case was the fact, that he was in a State that did not allow concealed carry and when the police approached him they could not see a weapon. Without any reasonable suspicion of a crime being committed, they would have had no Reasonable Articulable Suspicion to stop him in a concealed carry State. In Ohio it is legal to conceal carry with a license and open carry without one. Without any reasonable suspicion that you did not have a license to carry a concealed weapon, the police would not be justified to stop you on mere suspicion alone. Would that stop and search not be based purely on a hunch? Otherwise the police could stop and search anyone based on the mere fact that they MIGHT have a concealed weapon and they MIGHT NOT have a license to conceal one. Carrying a weapon openly in your waistband in and of itself would not be a crime either and therefore would not justify a stop and search. Did I get my point across or just confuse you? Maybe I am just thinking crazy. :?
Last edited by D_Weezy on Mon Oct 22, 2012 10:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: OC Video

Post by Werz »

D_Weezy wrote:Did I get my point across or just confuse you? Maybe I am just thinking crazy. :?
I understand the point. It's the lack of significant legal authority that's the problem. It's the open carry advocates finding a tiny nugget in some dicta of a concurring opinion and spreading it around like it's The Word of God®. It's really no different than the word going out amongst police officers that open carriers could be charged with Inducing Panic or Disorderly Conduct. Do you see my point?
"An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life."
-- Robert A. Heinlein, Beyond This Horizon
"Remember that protecting our gun rights still boils down to keeping a majority in the electorate, and that our daily activities can have the impact of being ambassadors for the gun culture ..."
-- BobK
Open carry is a First Amendment exercise.
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Re: OC Video

Post by Gaspode »

I was interested until I saw Rob Pincus was in the video.

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Re: OC Video

Post by D_Weezy »

Werz wrote:
D_Weezy wrote:Did I get my point across or just confuse you? Maybe I am just thinking crazy. :?
I understand the point. It's the lack of significant legal authority that's the problem. It's the open carry advocates finding a tiny nugget in some dicta of a concurring opinion and spreading it around like it's The Word of God®. It's really no different than the word going out amongst police officers that open carriers could be charged with Inducing Panic or Disorderly Conduct. Do you see my point?
I see your point. I am not trying to spread dicta as if it were Law. I am however guilty, of always trying to find that tiny LAWFUL nugget. :lol:
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Re: OC Video

Post by carmen fovozzo »

Gaspode wrote:I was interested until I saw Rob Pincus was in the video.

Nothing that nerf herder has to say will be worth a listen to. Ever.

Nerf herder. Is that a profession ? :)
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Re: OC Video

Post by wkdravenna »

Whos the Scruffy headed nerf herder ! ! !
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Re: OC Video

Post by TunnelRat »

I find it hard to believe that the officer who so egregiously violates the open carrier's rights is going to be quite as polite as the officers in this video.
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Re: OC Video

Post by Michael Porschien »

Never underestimate the convictions of someone trained and indoctrinated to believe that whatever they are doing at the time is the right thing to be doing. The officers who violate your rights and falsely arrest you are indeed the ones who put on a smile, talk conversationally with you, and then arrest you for no reason, because they do not like your choice. That being said, also remember that of the scenarios, the second one could very well lead to a civil lawsuit [deleted -- TR], culminating in his getting fired, your getting paid, and the police understanding that civil liberties are not to be tread upon. As my friend MyWifeSaidYes keeps reminding me, if you are going to open carry, you Cannot be afraid to get arrested for your choice. Let the cops do what they want to do at the time, to avoid getting shot, and then go at them, Hard. And always carry a recorder.

And who knows, after another 20 years of cops getting sued and fired for these kinds of gross color of law violations, they may just treat OCers with more respect.
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Re: OC Video

Post by Werz »

Michael Porschien wrote:Never underestimate the convictions of someone trained and indoctrinated to believe that whatever they are doing at the time is the right thing to be doing.
Keep in mind that the foregoing axiom also applies to people who have been indoctrinated by a gun forum into believing that they can do things which may not be lawful. You know what I'm talking about.
"An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life."
-- Robert A. Heinlein, Beyond This Horizon
"Remember that protecting our gun rights still boils down to keeping a majority in the electorate, and that our daily activities can have the impact of being ambassadors for the gun culture ..."
-- BobK
Open carry is a First Amendment exercise.
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