Found Sign on Cooler in BACK of an AmeriStop in Chillicothe

[18M_RWR]

I stopped into this AmeriStop carryout at 801 Western Ave in Chillicothe on Friday to use the restroom on my way to a funeral further down the street. I had to ask a female clerk who was stocking shelves if they had a restroom. She told me to go thru the door marked EMPLOYEES ONLY and it was to the left. As I walked to the door I noticed a gun buster sign on the side of the cooler. Of course I was open carrying! I used the restroom and when I came out of the back room I passed the same store clerk who was now going into the cooler. I thanked her and the female cashier on my way out the front door.

I stopped back in the store today (this time NOT carrying) to take these pics.




The same female cashier was working today, so I bought a bottle. As she was ringing up the sale I asked some questions:
Me: I noticed there is a no firearms allowed sign back on the side of the cooler.
Cashier: Yea, there is one back there. Her facial expressions indicated she was trying to remember the sign.
Me: But there are no signs any where at the front of the store or on the windows to see before you enter the store.
Cashier: As she scans the front windows/doors - You're right I don't see any on the windows or front door.
Me: Why is the sign only posted at the back of the store?
Cashier: I have no idea why it is only at the back of the store on the cooler.
Me: Someone could unknowingly enter the store while legally concealed or open carrying a firearm not realizing there is a sign in the back.
Cashier: Yes you're right.

Obviously she just worked there and wasn't responsible for where the sign is posted.


I wanted to post this for 2 reasons.
#1 to make everyone is aware of this AmeriStop in Chillicothe and that it is very poorly posted.
#2 to ask if place posts their gun buster sign in the back of the store like this one has and a person enters it carrying a firearm (concealed or open carrying) can that person be charged for violating a "posted" gun free zone?

[Mr. Glock]

That was posted for employees in the Employees Only area, along with all the other Employer-required notifications. You can't legally hide a gunbustrer sign in a back room and have it be valid for customers, it needs to be visible to customers entering the store to be valid.

I'd suggest that asking about it would be the wrong approach, as you might get the front customer entrance posted as an unintended consequence.

The policies of Ameristop toward employees is not your concern unless you choose to work there.

[MyWifeSaidYes]

NEVER ASK !!

It's fine to request the removal of a sign that is "conspicuously posted". A sign that's randomly posted like this one? LEAVE IT ALONE !!


Why?

As Mr. Glock mentioned..."unintended consequences".

Me: Why is the sign only posted at the back of the store?

Cashier: Oh, my!! You're absolutely right!! THAT SIGN SHOULD BE RIGHT ON THE FRONT DOOR. HERE, LET ME MOVE THAT RIGHT NOW.

[Brian D.]

We do appreciate your concern and enthusiasm here, don't take our corrective tone in any sort of negative manner, please.

[18M_RWR]

That was posted for employees in the Employees Only area, along with all the other Employer-required notifications. You can't legally hide a gunbustrer sign in a back room and have it be valid for customers, it needs to be visible to customers entering the store to be valid.

I don't see how any of these signs were posted for AmeriStop employees. They are in the customer/public area as the employee area is thru that doorway. All of the other postings are also customer related, not employer to employee related posting that all employers must post as federally mandated (i.e. minimum wages, OSHA, etc.). I am not concerned about AmeriStop's rules for their employees or what or how they post any of the federally mandated postings for them.

NEVER ASK !!

It's fine to request the removal of a sign that is "conspicuously posted". A sign that's randomly posted like this one? LEAVE IT ALONE !!

I understand the unintended consequences you have both mentioned and will keep them in mind in the future. After talking with this cashier I am certain the conversation won't get mentioned to a supervisor or manager.

So if a gunbuster sign is NOT posted "conspicuously" at the entry of an establishment it should be ignored since it "isn't valid"?

[18M_RWR]

We do appreciate your concern and enthusiasm here, don't take our corrective tone in any sort of negative manner, please.

No worries, my skin has been battle tested over the years; it's pretty tough nowdays...

[Mr. Glock]

Ahh...when you said Back of cooler and Employee Only area, I didn't take a close look at the actual signs in the photo.

The way I read it now, it really means no guns allowed in the cooler itself if entering from that door

[JustaShooter]

The way I read it now, it really means no guns allowed in the cooler itself if entering from that door

That was my first thought too!

So if a gunbuster sign is NOT posted "conspicuously" at the entry of an establishment it should be ignored since it "isn't valid"?

In my opinion once you see it, it was conspicuous enough for *you*, and just like if the cashier had said "you can't carry that in here, you have to leave", it's time to go.

Oh, and along with not telling the business the sign is improperly posted, I also recommend against telling other people about the sign since that potentially puts them under notice as well as you.

[18M_RWR]

The way I read it now, it really means no guns allowed in the cooler itself if entering from that door

That was my first thought too!

I had the same first thought "no guns allowed in the cooler"

So if a gunbuster sign is NOT posted "conspicuously" at the entry of an establishment it should be ignored since it "isn't valid"?

In my opinion once you see it, it was conspicuous enough for *you*, and just like if the cashier had said "you can't carry that in here, you have to leave", it's time to go.

Oh, and along with not telling the business the sign is improperly posted, I also recommend against telling other people about the sign since that potentially puts them under notice as well as you.

If I shouldn't tell others about the sign so as not to potentially put them under notice, then it seems this post should be deleted.
My questions about it have been sufficiently answered.

[M-Quigley]

The way I read it now, it really means no guns allowed in the cooler itself if entering from that door

That was my first thought too!

So if a gunbuster sign is NOT posted "conspicuously" at the entry of an establishment it should be ignored since it "isn't valid"?

In my opinion once you see it, it was conspicuous enough for *you*, and just like if the cashier had said "you can't carry that in here, you have to leave", it's time to go.

Oh, and along with not telling the business the sign is improperly posted, I also recommend against telling other people about the sign since that potentially puts them under notice as well as you.

This list doesn't put me on notice for anything. Anybody can potentially get on the Internet and say anything, oesn't make it the same weight as seeing the actual sign. Plus, even if it was true at the time it was posted, the sign could be down 10 minutes later. I'm not required by law to look in every nook and cranny of the store for a gun buster sign. If they really wanted no guns they would've put it at the front door. It was probably for the employees, just like most of the places I've worked for.

[Mr. Glock]

Also recall that back in the early days of Ohio CCW, a group was sending out those gunbuster signs to businesses, sort of pretending they had to be posted like other public notifications. I can't recall if it was anti- group or one of those a "buy our packet to keep your business legal" forms people.

[MyWifeSaidYes]

Also recall that back in the early days of Ohio CCW, a group was sending out those gunbuster signs to businesses, sort of pretending they had to be posted like other public notifications. I can't recall if it was anti- group or one of those a "buy our packet to keep your business legal" forms people.

It's still happening.

Those "all the forms and posters you need for your business" services all include a CPZ sticker. It's not listed as a required item, but everything else in the envelope IS. So, what would a prudent, but uninformed, person do?

[MyWifeSaidYes]

...
So if a gunbuster sign is NOT posted "conspicuously" at the entry of an establishment it should be ignored since it "isn't valid"?

In Ohio, such a sign is ALWAYS "valid", but it may not rise to support a charge of "knowingly" trespassing. You can't expect a person to stay out of your establishment if they can't see the sign before, or when, they enter.

And, although it started out tongue-in-cheek, posting a CPZ sign on an interior door, to me, means that the sign applies to the space behind the door. This is completely reasonable since the door to the left says, "Employees Only".

Also a good thing to remember...NO sign is needed for them to ask you to leave.

If asked to leave, leave.

Do not say that you didn't see a sign. Do not ask where the sign is. Do not argue about your rights. Leave and fight those battles later.

[troy bilt]

I bet the owner is in belief that this sign must be posted on the cooler that holds the alcohol. All the other signs on the cooler are pertaining to alcohol

I bet if it was explained to him that it did not need to be posted by law it would come down. But unless I was 100% sure of that I don't think I would bring it up at all.

[djthomas]

And, although it started out tongue-in-cheek, posting a CPZ sign on an interior door, to me, means that the sign applies to the space behind the door. This is completely reasonable since the door to the left says, "Employees Only".

And here's a situation where that is absolutely the case.

There's a well known technology outfit in the Cleveland area that I've had occasion to visit since my employer does business with them. Being one of those new fangled employers they have everything you could want - a gym, hair place, rec rooms, clinic, cafeteria, and an on site day care. The building is not posted and nothing was ever provided to me as a visitor stating that firearms were prohibited on the premises. However, on the door to the day care - both the exterior entrance and the one off the building lobby - is a standard CPZ sign.

The day care is required by law to be posted. The fact that the owners of the company walk by that CPZ sign every single day and seem to have never said to themselves "hmm, we need one of those on the main doors too" tells me all I need to know.

Back to this particular place - there was a time when Giant Eagle was under the assumption that they had to post the in-store liquor agencies. Notice all the other signs on the cooler pertaining to alcohol. That may very well be why everything is on the cooler.