Non-Resident CCW Help

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Non-Resident CCW Help

Postby ShooterInNeed » Wed Apr 11, 2018 8:06 pm

Hi all,

I’m new to this forum but I believe this will be the best place to start getting answers.
I am 20 and have always been an avid sport shooter, and have always intended on getting
my concealed license when I turn 21. However recent events have made me feel the need for more help.
I was recently stuck in a near empty parking lot at night awaiting someone to arrive to jump my car.
After I had pushed my car into a decent position for when my friend would arrive someone rushed me with the intention of robbing me with a knife. Fortunately for my life a passing Good Samaritan helped subdue the man until police arrived.
After the fact I came to the realization that if it had not been for that person things could have gone very differently.
Despite the fact that the state of Ohio seems to believe I don’t need to defend myself reality seems to disagree, so I have been looking into ways to protect myself in the future. I see that I could apply for a non-resident license from somewhere like Maine and Ohio should accept it as valid. However I can’t find any information on the grey area that is whether I would be able to use that in Ohio (which has reciprocity with and should accept a Maine license) even though I am an Ohio resident that is below the age to apply in Ohio. I have heard accounts of other young men who have done this successfully but that is hearsay at best. Please I would accept any knowledge any of you could give me.

Thank you
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Re: Non-Resident CCW Help

Postby Suckerspawn » Thu Apr 12, 2018 7:24 am

I'm all for carrying firearms but there are non lethal tools available to you, like pepper spray.
No, I am not a policeman. I am a mercenary praying for peace on Earth.
I don't want a tactical advantage. I want the bad guys to repent and find a new line of work.
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Re: Non-Resident CCW Help

Postby JustaShooter » Thu Apr 12, 2018 7:31 am

ShooterInNeed, there is a big hurdle you are going to have trouble overcoming even if you get an out-of-state license that Ohio would honor for an Ohio resident under 21. That is, unless you are military or law enforcement, there is no legal means for you to acquire a handgun in Ohio. An FFL is prohibited from selling one to you, and anyone who provides one to you is breaking Ohio law, even a relative who wants to give you one as a gift.
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Re: Non-Resident CCW Help

Postby ShooterInNeed » Thu Apr 12, 2018 1:21 pm

I didn’t think the the firearm in question would be as much of an issue as the permit itself, because as far as I’ve heard even 18 y/olds can open carry handguns and Ohio does not require a specific handgun to be assigned to a license.
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Re: Non-Resident CCW Help

Postby gaptrick » Thu Apr 12, 2018 2:14 pm

I hate to say it, and I don't like it any better than anyone else out there, but sometimes being a good soldier and waiting for your birthday to apply for your "government permit" to conceal a handgun is your best bet. You've lived 20 years without it so far so see about hanging in there a little while longer. I believe doing the class before your birthday is acceptable so you can apply for the license on your birthday... is this correct people?

Why 18, 19 and 20 year olds are denied the right to self preservation is beyond me. I suppose you can walk the streets with a shotty or an AR, or can you? Has Kasuck already put a stop to that?
Unarmed people are vulnerable people, and criminal predators prey upon them.

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Re: Non-Resident CCW Help

Postby JustaShooter » Thu Apr 12, 2018 8:56 pm

ShooterInNeed wrote:I didn’t think the the firearm in question would be as much of an issue as the permit itself, because as far as I’ve heard even 18 y/olds can open carry handguns and Ohio does not require a specific handgun to be assigned to a license.

The firearm in question *is* the biggest issue in Ohio. Except for law enforcement or military, there is no legal way for you to be in possession of a firearm outside of specific circumstances when under the direct supervision of a responsible adult.

Here's the relevant statute: From ORC 2923.21

2923.21 Improperly furnishing firearms to minor.

(A) No person shall do any of the following:

...
(5) Sell or furnish a handgun to a person who is twenty-one years of age or older if the seller or furnisher knows, or has reason to know, that the person is purchasing or receiving the handgun for the purpose of selling the handgun in violation of division (A)(2) of this section to a person who is under twenty-one years of age or for the purpose of furnishing the handgun in violation of division (A)(3) of this section to a person who is under twenty-one years of age;

...

(7) Purchase or attempt to purchase any handgun with the intent to sell the handgun in violation of division (A)(2) of this section to a person who is under twenty-one years of age or with the intent to furnish the handgun in violation of division (A)(3) of this section to a person who is under twenty-one years of age.

...

(C) Whoever violates this section is guilty of improperly furnishing firearms to a minor, a felony of the fifth degree.


http://codes.ohio.gov/orc/2923.21
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Re: Non-Resident CCW Help

Postby ShooterInNeed » Thu Apr 12, 2018 9:15 pm

Thank you for all the help. As far as the firearm is concerned like I said a lot of it was mostly hearsay so thank you for clearing that up. It look like I’ll just have to deal with it for a year.
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Re: Non-Resident CCW Help

Postby ShooterInNeed » Thu Apr 12, 2018 9:29 pm

Something that was just shown to me by one of the other parties I asked about this is and I would like input on if you could is how the constitution’s supremacy clause applies to this situation. If I am reading it right it should mean that a handgun could be privately sold or transferred to me at 18 because that is the federal standard. Any advice on that would be helpful.
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Re: Non-Resident CCW Help

Postby schmieg » Thu Apr 12, 2018 9:40 pm

ShooterInNeed wrote:Something that was just shown to me by one of the other parties I asked about this is and I would like input on if you could is how the constitution’s supremacy clause applies to this situation. If I am reading it right it should mean that a handgun could be privately sold or transferred to me at 18 because that is the federal standard. Any advice on that would be helpful.

This won't work unless you have tens of thousands of dollars to spend on legal fees and court costs and you would probably still lose. Unlike the 2nd Amendment, which is part of the Constitution, federal statutes not specifically made applicable to the states can be made more restrictive by the states. The states cannot make them less restrictive (unless it deals with illegal immigration or cannabis). Please note the text within the parentheses is sarcasm.
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Re: Non-Resident CCW Help

Postby wls » Fri Apr 13, 2018 7:12 am

Just my opinion and “gut” feel when I first read ShooterInNeed’s first post......his writing is very mature for a 20 YO, and now he is probing with questions that would lead someone here to provide an angle where he can acquire and/or carry a handgun under 21. My suspicion has been aroused, especially in today’s anti-gun world.

If ShooterInNeed is asking these questions in sincerity.....I apologize. But if he is looking for info to turn against this forum...be cautious in what information you provide. So far it appears that we have made it clear that, until he is 21, in Ohio he cannot purchase, own, or carry a handgun. It’s our law that we all abide by.
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Re: Non-Resident CCW Help

Postby TSiWRX » Fri Apr 13, 2018 8:49 am

^ Not unreasonable thinking - and I would be lying if I didn't think so, myself too. Which makes me sad, in and of itself. :(

But I'd like to think that society hasn't completely degraded to that point, yet. :)

In all honesty, in reading your OP, ShooterInNeed, my focus was on this particular sentence:

ShooterInNeed wrote:I was recently stuck in a near empty parking lot at night awaiting someone to arrive to jump my car.
After I had pushed my car into a decent position for when my friend would arrive someone rushed me with the intention of robbing me with a knife.


Your words imply that you're fit enough to push a vehicle. There's a huge difference between a Porsche 914 and a Ford Expedition :P , but still, even without knowing what you drive, it's a bit of physical exertion. Given that you can accomplish this task, I'd like to posit here that in your scenario above, your best defense would have been The Nike Defense: that rather than presenting a firearm (or, for that matter, any other weapon), your high-tailing it across that parking lot would have been the better choice.

But if running away is not feasible (as so often happens in my life due to a chronic injury, I'm again on crutches...I can prop my bad leg up on my driver's seat and use my good leg to push the car, but I can't effectively "run away" by any means of those words :oops: ) - or maybe by the time you noticed your assailant, the gap was already too close - I would also like to <strongly> suggest that in the real world, simply having a firearm may not be the savior that you imagine it to be: that the old adage of "don't bring a knife to a gunfight" is actually itself quite laughable.

Look up a few videos on YouTube about "The Tueller Drll," and you'll get a rudimentary understanding of what is known as "The 21 ft. Rule."

Once you can wrap your head around that morsel of information, look up on YouTube the keywords "realities of knife attack," and you'll get videos like this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E61jnJe_1SI

In your situation above, from that night....would you honestly have been able to bring your gun (if you'd had one) into play? How about any other weapon you may have been carrying? Where is that folding pocket-knife you carry for opening packages/mail or slicing your lunch/snack fruit? Can you get it out in time (here, it's not like the gun - you've gotta get this one out and *successfully* deploy it, too, locking that blade into functional positioning)? That can of pepper spray? Is it hanging out somewhere at the bottom of your pants pocket - or is it still on your keychain that's in-turn in the ignition of your vehicle?

I'm not suggesting that the legally carried concealed firearm isn't something that you'd want, here.

Far from it - otherwise, what would I be doing in this community, right? :)

But what I am saying is that while it is easy to come to this conclusion after you've had a real scare on a dark night, you should realize that the legally carried concealed firearm does not work as a magical amulet against evil.

Legalities notwithstanding, I would encourage you to look beyond hardware - be it a gun, knife, pepper spray or even a "miniature bat" ( https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/11/us/e ... oting.html ) and realize that getting some *_realistic_* empty-hands skills is likely going to be beneficial overall, and also to realize, as Jared Reston once said, that you are the weapon, and everything else is but a tool. :)
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Re: Non-Resident CCW Help

Postby ShooterInNeed » Fri Apr 13, 2018 2:54 pm

I apologize if I came off as trying to trick you all, I’ve been told I act too mature for my age but I know that carrying for defense is a very serious responsibility especially when legal ramifications can be involved. As for pushing the car, I’m not very in shape I just drive a little manual 95 mustang, it’s light enough that without the parking brake strong winds can give it a decent push. I did try to retreat from him like you suggested but the parking lot I was in was up against the L of the building so it a a bit of a big corner. Once again I didn’t mean to make it sound like I was trying to trick all of you for the purpose of anti-gun propaganda I would never do that And I wish there was a way I could prove to you that I’ve grown up with guns all my life.
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Re: Non-Resident CCW Help

Postby schmieg » Fri Apr 13, 2018 6:56 pm

Whatever you do, don't carry until you are 21 and don't carry concealed or in a vehicle until you have your CHL
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Re: Non-Resident CCW Help

Postby wls » Fri Apr 13, 2018 8:27 pm

I pleased you came back to respond and clarify your position. It’s also good to know there are still literate 20 YO in our society today, I was beginning to wonder.

You will continue to get good advice from the knowledgeable members of this forum, and you are obviously smart enough to heed the advice you receive here. If I have any advice to add it is wait until you are of age to purchase and carry a handgun....then get professional training...continually. You can never get enough training.

Best of luck to you.
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Re: Non-Resident CCW Help

Postby ShooterInNeed » Fri Apr 13, 2018 9:20 pm

Thank you. It looks like I’ll be waiting to carry. But I can definitely look into some of the drills suggested here, as well as looking into “less thanlethal” options, it seems like these are going to be my only defense for a while.

Thanks to everyone who replied with helpful advice.
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