List your notification horror stories here
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Re: List your notification horror stories here
I sincerely hope the duty to inform is removed asap. I feel it's an unreasonable search and clear 4th Amendment violation.
The real kick in the nuts is someone illegally carrying a gun does NOT have to inform police, as that's self incrimination.
The real kick in the nuts is someone illegally carrying a gun does NOT have to inform police, as that's self incrimination.
- jnor
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Re: List your notification horror stories here
I've always thought this should have been addressed before "restaurant carry".......
- Morne
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Re: List your notification horror stories here
Orlando highlights the danger of the 51% rule a lot of states have on restaurant carry. Here in Ohio we aren't so hamstrung.jnor wrote:I've always thought this should have been addressed before "restaurant carry".......
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Re: List your notification horror stories here
Orlando highlights the danger of allowing government at any level to stick its nose into what should be a matter for a private business/individual to decide.
Morne wrote:Orlando highlights the danger of the 51% rule a lot of states have on restaurant carry. Here in Ohio we aren't so hamstrung.
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- Dave44142
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Re: List your notification horror stories here
[quote="Mr. Glock"]Notification is either a non-issue for the officer or a big deal for the officer. In the end, it doesn't matter as every officer on every stop should assume there is at least one gun in the car anyway.
I was sitting at home one night, and my wife and I heard a loud bang. It was a cold and icy night in winter, and my house looked out over a main village street. I couldn't see anything in particular, but did see a car parked in my neighbor's driveway, perfectly parked but it hadn't been there earlier. I was armed at the time, so I threw on my coat and, with my wife observing from the house with the phone in hand, I ventured out. It was a loud bang, and deserved some investigation
Long story short, an older woman driver had slide on the icy road, hit the telephone pole outside my house and the car ended up in my neighbor's driveway, looking like it was perfectly parked. She was in shock, and the back of the SUV was missing glass etc.
My wife called 911, and I flagged down the first responding officer (remember, the car looked like it was parked). In the meantime, I was talking to the driver, keeping her calm.
And then, I had to notify.
So, the officer had to stop, examine me visually, and then decide on a course of action. He ended up telling me to return to my porch.
And then the officer had to figure out the whole situation on his own. Since I had been chatting with the women, I had information that would have been valuable in an emergency situation.
But, due to notification, I was immediately ordered off the scene by the officer.
Luckily, this was not a life or death situation for the driver. The time wasted with the notification, officer decisions and then the officer tracking my movements was wasted time in an emergency situation. Kind of silly, actually, since I would hardly announce an armed ambush if that was my intent. Also, I had asertained information that the responding ambulance squad might have found useful, such as injury location etc.
Wasn't a horror story for me in particular, but could have been for the driver of she'd been more seriously injured.[/quo>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.............
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
IS is not the law that you only need to"Notify" When you are Stopped for law enforcment purpose? Not when you see someone with a uniform or badge?
I was sitting at home one night, and my wife and I heard a loud bang. It was a cold and icy night in winter, and my house looked out over a main village street. I couldn't see anything in particular, but did see a car parked in my neighbor's driveway, perfectly parked but it hadn't been there earlier. I was armed at the time, so I threw on my coat and, with my wife observing from the house with the phone in hand, I ventured out. It was a loud bang, and deserved some investigation
Long story short, an older woman driver had slide on the icy road, hit the telephone pole outside my house and the car ended up in my neighbor's driveway, looking like it was perfectly parked. She was in shock, and the back of the SUV was missing glass etc.
My wife called 911, and I flagged down the first responding officer (remember, the car looked like it was parked). In the meantime, I was talking to the driver, keeping her calm.
And then, I had to notify.
So, the officer had to stop, examine me visually, and then decide on a course of action. He ended up telling me to return to my porch.
And then the officer had to figure out the whole situation on his own. Since I had been chatting with the women, I had information that would have been valuable in an emergency situation.
But, due to notification, I was immediately ordered off the scene by the officer.
Luckily, this was not a life or death situation for the driver. The time wasted with the notification, officer decisions and then the officer tracking my movements was wasted time in an emergency situation. Kind of silly, actually, since I would hardly announce an armed ambush if that was my intent. Also, I had asertained information that the responding ambulance squad might have found useful, such as injury location etc.
Wasn't a horror story for me in particular, but could have been for the driver of she'd been more seriously injured.[/quo>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.............
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
IS is not the law that you only need to"Notify" When you are Stopped for law enforcment purpose? Not when you see someone with a uniform or badge?
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- JustaShooter
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Re: List your notification horror stories here
You are correct, the law says "stopped for a law enforcement purpose" but many have expanded that to mean any official interaction with law enforcement to be on the safe side. It is enough of a grey area that many don't want to unwittingly end up on the wrong side of an interaction - and I can hardly blame them. Mandatory notification needs to go.Dave44142 wrote:IS is not the law that you only need to"Notify" When you are Stopped for law enforcment purpose? Not when you see someone with a uniform or badge?
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Re: List your notification horror stories here
And it's not much of a mental stretch for me to imagine that in Dave's situation, that same officer would unhesitatingly arrest a CHL holder for not notifying, if he found out while there during the wreck investigation, somehow. Ordering Dave off the scene in that manner makes this particular officer seem like a dipstick to me.JustaShooter wrote:You are correct, the law says "stopped for a law enforcement purpose" but many have expanded that to mean any official interaction with law enforcement to be on the safe side. It is enough of a grey area that many don't want to unwittingly end up on the wrong side of an interaction - and I can hardly blame them. Mandatory notification needs to go.Dave44142 wrote:IS is not the law that you only need to"Notify" When you are Stopped for law enforcment purpose? Not when you see someone with a uniform or badge?
Quit worrying, hide your gun well, shut up, and CARRY that handgun!
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- Mr. Glock
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Re: List your notification horror stories here
JustaShooter wrote:You are correct, the law says "stopped for a law enforcement purpose" but many have expanded that to mean any official interaction with law enforcement to be on the safe side. It is enough of a grey area that many don't want to unwittingly end up on the wrong side of an interaction - and I can hardly blame them. Mandatory notification needs to go.Dave44142 wrote:IS is not the law that you only need to"Notify" When you are Stopped for law enforcment purpose? Not when you see someone with a uniform or badge?
Calling into 911 pretty much makes any LE interaction after that point "an official interaction", relating to that call. Further, even if I had not called, an LEO investigating a call about a crash would also be approaching me in "an official capacity". In both cases, a law enforcement purpose.
If you don't think that might be the same as "Stopped of Law Enforcement Purposes", just try walking away without saying anything to the officer when he queries you. If they then verbally stop you, you've already started the notification clock ticking and you are getting a bit late in the game to notify (as well as ratcheting up the responding officer's stress level on a cold, dark night, which is never a good thing).
Street lawyering never works out too well, so a slightly broader definition of "stopped for law enforcement purposes" and when to quickly notify can usually be a good thing. Until notification is gone, of course.
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- rDigital
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Re: List your notification horror stories here
I have a story.
- JustaShooter
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Re: List your notification horror stories here
You will notice I never disagreed with your approach, and in fact noted that I could hardly blame those that follow a generous interpretation. That word "stopped" *should* mean an involuntary official interaction (as "stopped" is generally interchangeable with "detained" as I understand it), but I and others have long ago decided not to try to be the test case for such an interpretation. That and other issues are what give mandatory notification a big grey area fraught with peril, and as such, it just needs to go.Mr. Glock wrote:JustaShooter wrote:You are correct, the law says "stopped for a law enforcement purpose" but many have expanded that to mean any official interaction with law enforcement to be on the safe side. It is enough of a grey area that many don't want to unwittingly end up on the wrong side of an interaction - and I can hardly blame them. Mandatory notification needs to go.Dave44142 wrote:IS is not the law that you only need to"Notify" When you are Stopped for law enforcment purpose? Not when you see someone with a uniform or badge?
Calling into 911 pretty much makes any LE interaction after that point "an official interaction", relating to that call. Further, even if I had not called, an LEO investigating a call about a crash would also be approaching me in "an official capacity". In both cases, a law enforcement purpose.
If you don't think that might be the same as "Stopped of Law Enforcement Purposes", just try walking away without saying anything to the officer when he queries you. If they then verbally stop you, you've already started the notification clock ticking and you are getting a bit late in the game to notify (as well as ratcheting up the responding officer's stress level on a cold, dark night, which is never a good thing).
Street lawyering never works out too well, so a slightly broader definition of "stopped for law enforcement purposes" and when to quickly notify can usually be a good thing. Until notification is gone, of course.
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- Mr. Glock
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Re: List your notification horror stories here
I was just expanding, not trying to correcting anyone.
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- schmieg
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Re: List your notification horror stories here
If notification serves a purpose (which I dispute), then those situations where the citizen stops the officer might be more dangerous in this day and age than the converse.JustaShooter wrote: You will notice I never disagreed with your approach, and in fact noted that I could hardly blame those that follow a generous interpretation. That word "stopped" *should* mean an involuntary official interaction (as "stopped" is generally interchangeable with "detained" as I understand it), but I and others have long ago decided not to try to be the test case for such an interpretation. That and other issues are what give mandatory notification a big grey area fraught with peril, and as such, it just needs to go.
However, I sincerely doubt that anyone who plans to shoot an officer will notify in either event. The sad thing is that even if we put the onus on the officer to ask, those of ill will still won't notify unless they think there might be reasonable grounds to be searched.
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- Morne
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Re: List your notification horror stories here
Last call for horror stories.
I am compiling a master list to take with us for next week's advocacy day. I expect it to be...bulky...
I am compiling a master list to take with us for next week's advocacy day. I expect it to be...bulky...
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Re: List your notification horror stories here
Morne wrote:Last call for horror stories.
I am compiling a master list to take with us for next week's advocacy day. I expect it to be...bulky...
A few post's above this one, rDigital posted as though he had an issue with LE regarding notification and I PM'ed him about it, so hopefully he see's it and post's .....soon.
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Re: List your notification horror stories here
My son and I were at Moore Park in Bryan the other day playing with Nerf guns. Someone called the police claiming we were shooting real guns at squirrels.Morne wrote:If you have been harassed/arrested/charged/convicted of "failure to notify" about your armed status as a concealed handgun licensee in Ohio please give the details in this thread. Links to court cases would be particularly helpful.
If you aren't comfortable doing so in an open forum you can also PM me.
We've got some ideas on this law (that desperately needs changing) and need the evidence of abuse compiled together in order to make a move with it. Your help in this matter is essential!
I am not a licencee and thus did not inform upon contact. The officer noted our Nerf guns and called the whole thing off.
Seriously people? I'm playing with a toy with my pre-teen child and you call the {inappropriate language} cops? What the hell is wrong with you?