Pulled over with an expiried ccw lcs.

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plumberbill
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Pulled over with an expiried ccw lcs.

Post by plumberbill »

I was pulled over for speeding in Strongsville Ohio. I properly informed the officer that i had a cc lcs. and my firearm was in the counsel. He asked for my cc lcs. and much to my surprise he informed me that my lcs. was expired for 6 month. My firearm was confiscated and i was issued a misdemeanor citation for "improper handling of a firearm in a vehicle did knowingly transport a firearm in a motor vehicle" In violation of section 672.04(a) m4.The next day i reapplied and received my new lcs Two weeks later. I went in front of the magistrate and showed my lcs. but the prosecuter and the magistrate appeared unsure about the law so I asked for and got a new court date. I have searched this site but found no exact situation like this, I spoke with an attorney who said the most they can do is charge me with a misdemeanor. my question is do i go back to court by my self being that this is a m-4 or do i spend the money and get an attorney. (which is pretty costly) I would appreciate some input.
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Re: Pulled over with an expiried ccw lcs.

Post by Javelin Man »

It is rare that investing in an attorney is money poorly spent. He/she would give excellent advice. The officer could have charged you with something far greater resulting in you getting cuffed and stuffed so he did a fine professional job in handling things well.
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Re: Pulled over with an expiried ccw lcs.

Post by djthomas »

Ohio does not currently have a licensure exception that fits your case. An expired license is valid for 30 days past expiration. And you can renew at any time when expired. You can get a charged knocked down to an MM if you can show that you were licensed at the time of the offense but that does not apply to you. In the eyes of the law you were unlicensed at the time of the offense.

IMHO you caught a real break with an M4. While renewing your license doesn't legally matter in the case before you, it might be a persuasive mitigating factor when it comes to sentencing. An M4 carries a max of 30 days in jail and a $250 fine. With no past record I would push to see if you could be sentenced to no time, full fine and costs. Or maybe you can get it amended to a disorderly conduct charge - who knows, but that's where having an attorney to talk the talk behind closed doors helps.

I'm no lawyer and can't give legal advice, but if it were me I'd want to find a way to plead guilty to something, either the M4 as charged or some MM and get the case closed quickly, lest someone decide to dismiss it and file felony charges at the county level.
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Re: Pulled over with an expiried ccw lcs.

Post by CroManGun »

Expired for 6 months??? DUH!!!
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Re: Pulled over with an expiried ccw lcs.

Post by gaptrick »

CroManGun wrote:Expired for 6 months??? DUH!!!

I once rode out my expired drivers license for 8 months. I had to take the written and road test again.. at over 50 years old.

The trooper got in and I greeted her with, "How ya doin'.. Remember me?"
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plumberbill
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Re: Pulled over with an expiried ccw lcs.

Post by plumberbill »

Thanks for the kind replies, I think an attorney while costly, is a good idea under the circumstances. It certainly was an honest mistake, wish i had a superb memory.
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Re: Pulled over with an expiried ccw lcs.

Post by WY_Not »

Who needs a good memory when calendar apps are on all phones, tablets, iPods, PC's, Macs, etc. And Google. :mrgreen:
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Re: Pulled over with an expiried ccw lcs.

Post by MyWifeSaidYes »

plumberbill wrote:Thanks for the kind replies, I think an attorney while costly, is a good idea under the circumstances. It certainly was an honest mistake, wish i had a superb memory.
Google Calendar (or other online calendar)

Put your important dates in it, such as LICENSE EXPIRATION DATES (driver license -OR- CHL) :wink:

Set it to remind you AND your spouse/parent/child a couple months prior to the expiration date, in addition to the actual expiration date.


You add someone else for notifications in case your email address changes sometime in the next 4 to 5 years (and you forget to update your reminder).

You want to be notified PRIOR to the expiration date so you can schedule a renewal appointment (if needed).

I've also added my wife and son's driver license expiration dates.
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Re: Pulled over with an expiried ccw lcs.

Post by dl1911 »

You're very lucky! Had a similar case come before me on a grand jury last year. Technically you were carry concealed without a license which is a felony. Seeing how you were only charged with a misdemeanor, count yourself very lucky.
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Re: Pulled over with an expiried ccw lcs.

Post by Bama.45 »

dl1911 wrote:You're very lucky! Had a similar case come before me on a grand jury last year. Technically you were carry concealed without a license which is a felony. Seeing how you were only charged with a misdemeanor, count yourself very lucky.

This is what I was thinking. Personally instead of rescheduling a court date I would have seen about paying a fine and being done with it... I mean, you were breaking the law.
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Re: Pulled over with an expiried ccw lcs.

Post by cashman966 »

dl1911 wrote:You're very lucky! Had a similar case come before me on a grand jury last year. Technically you were carry concealed without a license which is a felony. Seeing how you were only charged with a misdemeanor, count yourself very lucky.

Actually since his license expired within 2 years of the offence and he renewed it within 45 days, had he been charged with a CCW violation all he would need to do would wave his speedy trial right and it would have been a 3rd degree misdemeanor (I am guessing the level based on fine)
2923.12 Carrying concealed weapons.
(A) No person shall knowingly carry or have, concealed on the person's person or concealed ready at hand, any of the following:
(2) A handgun other than a dangerous ordnance;


F(2) If a person being arrested for a violation of division (A)(2) of this section promptly produces a valid concealed handgun license, and if at the time of the violation the person was not knowingly in a place described in division (B) of section 2923.126 of the Revised Code, the officer shall not arrest the person for a violation of that division. If the person is not able to promptly produce any concealed handgun license and if the person is not in a place described in that section, the officer may arrest the person for a violation of that division, and the offender shall be punished as follows:

(b) The offender shall be guilty of a misdemeanor and shall be fined five hundred dollars if all of the following apply:

(i) The offender previously had been issued a concealed handgun license , and that license expired within the two years immediately preceding the arrest.

(ii) Within forty-five days after the arrest, the offender presents a concealed handgun license to the law enforcement agency that employed the arresting officer, and the offender waives in writing the offender's right to a speedy trial on the charge of the violation that is provided in section 2945.71 of the Revised Code.

(iii) At the time of the commission of the offense, the offender was not knowingly in a place described in division (B) of section 2923.126 of the Revised Code.
If it were me I would give serious thought to asking the prosecutor what kind of sentencing recommendation deal he might offer if I plead guilty. lower fine no jail or full fine no jail and return of firearm? Need to weigh the value of the gun when looking at an offer (if any are made). That is where a lawyer would help you out.
Last edited by cashman966 on Thu Feb 25, 2016 11:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Pulled over with an expiried ccw lcs.

Post by MyWifeSaidYes »

And don't plan on getting your gun back. :cry:
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Re: Pulled over with an expiried ccw lcs.

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Re: Pulled over with an expiried ccw lcs.

Post by MyWifeSaidYes »

To everyone mentioning felonies, you'll want to note just how lucky the OP is to have been charged under a LOCAL ORDINANCE (no felonies).

To the OP, let your attorney know to NOT bring this up. There is nothing stopping them from adjusting your ticket due to an "administrative error" and charging you under the state statute instead.

Plead forgetfulness, show remorse, show that you went and renewed your CHL right away, talk up the fact that this means you passed another background check, beg for diversion and don't sweat losing your gun. If they won't consider diversion, try to get the charge dropped to a minor misdemeanor. Pay a fine, do some community service, deal with a few months of probation, forfeit the gun... anything to keep from catching a felony charge.
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plumberbill
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Re: Pulled over with an expiried ccw lcs.

Post by plumberbill »

one of the first things i did was add this to my google calendar. While in court one of the last things the magistrate said to me was "at this time I cannot return your firearm" so he did show a willingness to return my property. He also mentioned that he had a conversation with the officer (who happened to be in court that day) who wrote the tickets and he truly believed that i honestly didn't know the lcs. was expired.
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