9mm v. 45 v. Rifle A Doctor's View of Gunshot Wounds

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9mm v. 45 v. Rifle A Doctor's View of Gunshot Wounds

Postby BobK » Fri Aug 31, 2012 4:30 pm

This is a long video by a ER/OR doc discussing his experiences with gunshot wounds. A few gory photos!

I think I can honestly say I've never watched a video this long that was linked on a gun forum. Usually, I'll watch a minute or two and click somewhere else -- short attention span.

This one was pretty interesting and kept me engaged for the full 34 minutes!

http://youtube.com/watch?v=tku8YI68-JA
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Re: 9mm v. 45 v. Rifle A Doctor's View of Gunshot Wounds

Postby SigMan » Fri Aug 31, 2012 6:49 pm

I watched the entire video, pretty interesting. Thanks for posting.
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Re: 9mm v. 45 v. Rifle A Doctor's View of Gunshot Wounds

Postby CCIman » Fri Aug 31, 2012 7:02 pm

That's a good lecture.
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Re: 9mm v. 45 v. Rifle A Doctor's View of Gunshot Wounds

Postby Tweed Ring » Fri Aug 31, 2012 8:48 pm

I am not familiar with gunshot wounds. However, I have seen a myriad of stabbing, cutting, slashing wounds. The bigger the slicing instrument, the more damage inflicted.
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Re: 9mm v. 45 v. Rifle A Doctor's View of Gunshot Wounds

Postby pleasantguywhopacks » Fri Aug 31, 2012 9:41 pm

Only makes me want a rifle in a fight. I didn't see much on the degrees of inflicted injury of the 9 to the 45. Just handgun to rifle.\\

9mm suites my needs just fine. Now lets get loaded definition changed so I can carry my AR and some mags.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOxXpNBdrVE
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Re: 9mm v. 45 v. Rifle A Doctor's View of Gunshot Wounds

Postby brian0918 » Fri Aug 31, 2012 10:21 pm

I'm surprised at how little force a handgun bullet has when hitting you - he said for 9mm it's like catching a 10lb weight that was dropped only half an inch. So much for "stopping power".
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Re: 9mm v. 45 v. Rifle A Doctor's View of Gunshot Wounds

Postby gmhiggins » Fri Aug 31, 2012 10:41 pm

brian0918 wrote:I'm surprised at how little force a handgun bullet has when hitting you - he said for 9mm it's like catching a 10lb weight that was dropped only half an inch. So much for "stopping power".


The name "stopping power" is a misnomer anyhow. Bullets available to civilians won't "knock you down" - the knock down is an effect from the wound itself (vital organ, CNS) or a mental trigger. People hit by bullets in real life don't get "thrown back". The round penetrates the skin, organs, some bones (others it can and will ricochet) and blood vessels.
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Re: 9mm v. 45 v. Rifle A Doctor's View of Gunshot Wounds

Postby CCIman » Sat Sep 01, 2012 8:23 am

oversimplification ... he is just implying that what you see in movies has "fantasticized" what happens in reality. On the other hand we all already knew this: based on Newton's laws the impact of the bullet hits nearly as hard as the recoil we feel when we fire the gun- only it is concentrated over a much smaller area, with a high speed projectile.

Amazing how or mental visualizations or reality are shaped by hollywood. So much for John Woo movies, or the Terminator being blown through a glass window.

The concept of the handgun is virtually shaped by entertainment media. As a defensive tool, I have more "stopping power" and "knock down" potential with my (fist maybe), ball bat, or hammer than with my 9mm. I can hit you anywhere on your body with my hammer (your thumb, kneecap, your noggin, or your shin) and basically incapacitate you faster than shooting you with my Glock once or twice in the chest. That is reality. Headshots or spinal cord shots are a different (gray) matter.

The worth of the handgun:
psychological deterrence
killing tool- accept that it can take time unless the shot is head/neck, or spine shot
opponent is armed, or stronger, or far away



brian0918 wrote:I'm surprised at how little force a handgun bullet has when hitting you - he said for 9mm it's like catching a 10lb weight that was dropped only half an inch. So much for "stopping power".
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Re: 9mm v. 45 v. Rifle A Doctor's View of Gunshot Wounds

Postby carmen fovozzo » Sat Sep 01, 2012 10:14 am

gmhiggins wrote:
brian0918 wrote:I'm surprised at how little force a handgun bullet has when hitting you - he said for 9mm it's like catching a 10lb weight that was dropped only half an inch. So much for "stopping power".


The name "stopping power" is a misnomer anyhow. Bullets available to civilians won't "knock you down" - the knock down is an effect from the wound itself (vital organ, CNS) or a mental trigger. People hit by bullets in real life don't get "thrown back". The round penetrates the skin, organs, some bones (others it can and will ricochet) and blood vessels.


Well I saw the Lone Ranger shoot someone in the stomach once and the BG was standing on this big 20ft. boulder and he fell forward onto the ground.... :wink:
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Re: 9mm v. 45 v. Rifle A Doctor's View of Gunshot Wounds

Postby TSiWRX » Sat Sep 01, 2012 10:57 am

^ That dates you, you know, Carmen? :lol: :P :lol:


-----


brian0918, it's been a while since I viewed that presentation, but IIRC, much of the information was derived from these two sources:

http://www.firearmstactical.com/hwfe.htm

^ That's a link to the FBI "Handgun Wounding Factors and Effectiveness" paper.

and

http://ammo.ar15.com/project/Self_Defen ... /index.htm

The "Best Choices for Self Defense Ammo" compilation post, which took a lot from DocGKR's posts on the subject. Dr. Roberts is a vetted Industry Professional in the M4Carbine.net community.
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Re: 9mm v. 45 v. Rifle A Doctor's View of Gunshot Wounds

Postby CCIman » Sat Sep 01, 2012 12:34 pm

Always accompanied by the obligatory Wilhelm Scream of pain/suffering/death.

Wilhelm scream

Then followed by scenes where the bullet must be cut out, once it is cut out, then the victim survives. Even in the terminator2, they wasted time digging bullets out of Arnold's back.

In real life, finding the bullet is part of looking for associated tissue damage, repair and controlling bleeding, along the bullet path. You can cause alot more damage digging around just looking for the bullet - Which is how President Garfield died: ultimately of infection and sepsis from all those bare physician fingers poking around in his wounds looking for the projectile.
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Re: 9mm v. 45 v. Rifle A Doctor's View of Gunshot Wounds

Postby TSiWRX » Sat Sep 01, 2012 2:07 pm

^ Awesome!!!!! I didn't know about that scream!!! :D
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Re: 9mm v. 45 v. Rifle A Doctor's View of Gunshot Wounds

Postby Glock23 » Tue Sep 04, 2012 10:57 am

The worth of the handgun:
psychological deterrence
killing tool- accept that it can take time unless the shot is head/neck, or spine shot
opponent is armed, or stronger, or far away


And as I have always viewed it, a means to get to your rifle.
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Re: 9mm v. 45 v. Rifle A Doctor's View of Gunshot Wounds

Postby Mike0589 » Tue Sep 04, 2012 11:37 am

Very interesting video, thanks! 8)
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Re: 9mm v. 45 v. Rifle A Doctor's View of Gunshot Wounds

Postby parbreaker » Tue Sep 04, 2012 2:30 pm

Good video.

To me I think the most important thing it should reinforce is that a handgun, even a primary carry handgun, is only a stopgap measure until you can either get out of the conflict or get to a proper weapon.

There's a reason many of us keep loaded rifles and shotguns even though we always carry handguns. They're just on two different levels.

Of course... that being said I'd probably put a S&W500 up against alot of rifles in close combat effectiveness. That's far from typical though, lol. (and you've only got 5 shots compared to 30 in an AK or AR)
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