A Discussion of the Perfect Trunk Gun?

[jeep45238]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Nug5FZgxuk" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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[glocksmith]

I'm curious why no one mentioned over-penetration. An AK rifle or "pistol" in 7,62x39 will without fail penetrate any opponent and go sailing off into the wild blue yonder to wreak havoc elsewhere...every time. The topic of over-penetration routinely comes up in discussions of handguns and hollow-point ammo....but with an AK it is a no brainer.
In a perfect world, I'd pick a "dumbed down" round like the .45 acp...a Tommy Gun would be an awesome trunk gun but it doesn't fit the OP's requirements of "not too costly".

[glocksmith]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Nug5FZgxuk

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Jeep...this is about the only minigun most of us here can afford....an Airsoft or some such

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LKq-uLl8jkE

[TSiWRX]

I'm curious why no one mentioned over-penetration.

Because, to me, lethality goes hand-in-hand with terminal performance.

Managing the backstop/background as well as foreground are concerns with *every* shoot, because "over-penetration" is always a possibility.

And that said:

https://www.ar15.com/ammo/project/Self_ ... ocId759557" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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One caveat: You want something that is, as much as possible, impervious to rust. I learned this the hard way. Even if your trunk is well sealed from water, Ohio weather - with constant changes in temperature - causes a lot of moisture condensation in the trunk. That condensed moisture will be drawn to the steel on the gun, even if the trunk is otherwise dry, and even if the gun is kept in a gun case.

Ooooh. Good point.

What about silicone impregnated foam padding.

[Javelin Man]

In a situation like that, perhaps over-penetration might be a benefit.

[MyWifeSaidYes]

I'm curious why no one mentioned over-penetration...

My assumption is that the driver is already armed with a handgun loaded with hollow point ammunition.

If you need extra ammo for the handgun, that should already be on your person.

If things get so bad that a trunk gun is called for, over-penetration is probably not at the top of your list of concerns.

Since you won't be in your vehicle, you can mitigate over-penetration risks by moving and choosing your direction of fire.

Of course, that would depend on just how much S has hit the F.

[M-Quigley]

http://www.iacshotguns.com/97w.html

I know I'm breaking the OP's rules...he said "high capacity" and more than a shotgun. But the above is what I'd like to have in my trunk. Holds six rounds of 00-Buckshot rounds and can be slam fired by holding down the trigger and vigorously working the "corn cob" forend. At that point it becomes a "scattergun"...no matter how many BG's confronting you...they will scatter when you let it rip...assuming they are still standing

Are there any newer shotguns that do this? Back in the 80's the only new shotguns available for general sale were not able to do this. My issued shotgun was able to slam fire, and was always transported chamber empty. I know the website link lists a new version of an old classic, but it also says this:

IAC 1897 cowboy is a 12GA pump shotgun that is an exact reproduction of Winchester’s model 1897 except for added enhancements that improve safety and performance.

https://www.quora.com/Why-arent-modern- ... o-slamfire" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Brian D.]

I think most all US shotguns made for the last 50+years include a disconnector. Early Winchester model 12's and Ithaca model 37's are the ones that come to mind first as not having disconnectors.

[Brian D.]

Pfft. Probably closer to 80 years since the guns capable of such "slam fire" were made domestically. No idea about foreign brands.

[jeep45238]

In a situation like that, perhaps over-penetration might be a benefit.

I think that's the primary reason for having a long gun period - penetration and capacity. If you're going to get any type of projectile launcher, there is ALWAYS going to be a decent risk of "over" penetration.

The reason for this is the variations of humans and our densities. Look at a bus stop, and you'll likely see weights ranging from 130-350 pounds, with a very large discrepancy in the depth of the chest/torso region. You can't expect to penetrate the deep chest cavity enough to incapacitate without going through the very shallow one with a typical rifle cartridge.

WIth proper ammunition selection this can be mitigated to an extent. The high end 5.56 JHP rounds are designed to halt after XYZ inches - if the chest cavity is less than this, well, it's going out. If it's greater it's staying inside.

I don't have a trunk gun, and honestly doubt I will unless things really start going downhill (plus, we have a hatchback - securing is a huge problem). If such a time comes, it will be with a 5.45 rifle loaded with solid core ammunition. The reason I don't care about penetration with a rifle is simple: it's being pulled out because the handgun is woefully inadequate, which probably means armor, multiple attackers armed with rifles, and the strong chance of surrounding vehicles being used as barriers to shoot behind. The only way to effectively counter this is ammunition. If I had a 7.62x51 option, such as a reliable CETME/G3 pattern, I would still use FMJ ammunition - and in this case would prefer that larger round.

[TSiWRX]

I think that's the primary reason for having a long gun period - penetration and capacity. If you're going to get any type of projectile launcher, there is ALWAYS going to be a decent risk of "over" penetration.

The reason for this is the variations of humans and our densities. Look at a bus stop, and you'll likely see weights ranging from 130-350 pounds, with a very large discrepancy in the depth of the chest/torso region. You can't expect to penetrate the deep chest cavity enough to incapacitate without going through the very shallow one with a typical rifle cartridge.

Exactly.

There's no magic bullet, yet.

I always need to mind my background. I always need to mind my foreground.

The variables of the target means that penetration is just penetration - and I just need it in order to have the lethal effect I need, to defend myself effectively against the lethal threat that I am facing.

To me, there is no "over" penetration. There is simply a need to pay attention to the background.

[MeanStreaker]

Now that I have built my first AR15 pistol (in 300 Blackout), I think that's about the perfect trunk gun due to its size, weight, and capabilities. However, since I insist on using only quality parts for a gun I'd depend upon, and there are some crap AR makers out there... the cost is a big downside for something that I want to just leave (somewhat) vulnerable in a car all the time.

I've been looking hard at the Mossberg MVP rifle in .308. It takes PMags or M1A mags, 16" barrel, light(ish), inexpensive(ish), and not as scary looking.

[Brian D.]

One caveat: You want something that is, as much as possible, impervious to rust. I learned this the hard way. Even if your trunk is well sealed from water, Ohio weather - with constant changes in temperature - causes a lot of moisture condensation in the trunk. That condensed moisture will be drawn to the steel on the gun, even if the trunk is otherwise dry, and even if the gun is kept in a gun case.

Just a word to the wise.

I meant to chime in with my complete agreement on this when you posted it up, but forgot. Over even a day or two the weather conditions can vary so widely that it's like rust is a fast spreading micro-organism. Same sort of thing can happen when taking guns inside/outside or vice versa. Better to be overly cautious and keep the guns protected properly. Think of it like a fair skinned red headed person has to with their skin in the sun. Sort of.

[Aesinsp]

There's no magic bullet, yet.

Or is there??... Enter the frangible bullet. YMMV. OK - it's not magic, but I thought this was a decent lead-in.
http://ammo.com/bullet-type/frangible" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[TSiWRX]

^ I'm not convinced, with the above article, particularly given its mention of the Glaser rounds.

Penetration = wounding = physiologic stop.

Penetration will always carry a concern for the backstop/background.